My new 380 range report

[Tinman507]

I shake my head when I read some of the new gun stories and see someone with a brand new gun whining about break in issues.

But I gotta tell ya rogerthedodger: you have one hell of a lot more tenacity than I would have. That gun woulda gone back with an insistence it be replaced after about round 3. God Bless you for your patience. Mother Teresa is shaking her head.

[Cokeman]

I don't see how jams,stovepipes and light strikes make lead come out when they happen. All I was saying if it was my gun it goes back to Kahr with recurring malfunctions after breakin. If I had to sell off my guns the last ones to go would be my mk's.

Every round didn't have a jam or light strike and stovepipes do make lead come out. Light strike rounds can be shot again. I agree about sending it back after break in, but I disagree about sending it in during or when break in should end. Shooting those wasted break in rounds, you still learn how to shoot the gun well and how it works. Mine had FRTB, light strikes, and a few stovepipes that went away after the break in period which was more than 200 rounds.

[rogerthedodger]

Well Tinman507, If I was still age 35, wife + 4 kids, full time job, that P380 would not have been mine, my patience is WAY too short!! LOL

[kerby9mm]

I'm not a Doctor so I don't have any patience either!

[jocko]

allcomments are IMO on target. My point would be after 200 rounds, really could mean nothing if progress was being made with reliability. Some guns do need more TLC to get right, some no matter what will not get right without a trip back to the factory. Who can make that decision. ONLY U THE OWNER/SHOOTER should know if ur making any real progress towards reliability. That is why I feel the propper prepping kahr is a good one to go by for a new gun. IMO if a person reads it all and goes through his gun before that first shoot and eliminates what possably could be little pcky issues, then he is way ahead of the game for that first shoot. Then after 200 rounds if progress is going backwards, I think it is time to go back. What Rogerdogger did was commendable, I would not expect any owner to go through what he went through. Undoubtely he loved the P380 enough to know that no matter how much time it took, he was going to make a good gun out of it for him. I really do think the P380 is one of the nicest guns on the market WHEN THEY WORK RIGHT. It shoots great, feels great, looks great, top quality BUT THE FOKKER MUST WORK. I must admit before the coming of kahr for me, I owqned 3 kel tecks and at the time they were about the only game in town for such a small as sultra copact 380 or 32. I wanted to love those guns to death, but after 17 times back to kel teck to get right, I finally had to face the fact that my 3 kt;'s were just never going to be reliable for me to keep. So in a way I know what Roger dogger went through, only for me it was 17 times all total. Turned out to be a total waste of my time, energy, frustration, cost

Some ownesr we know take a gun right out of the box and shoot it and if it screws up, it goes back. to me that is putting the cart before the horse. A clean gun is a good gun, Some kahrs come out of the box so full of sh-t that it is a wonder they worked through the kahr test fire even. I persnally feel every gun u buy, especially a semi auto should be throughly cleaned and lubed properly and some basic things just checked out to be sure it is all right. Good example is mag springs in backwards, its gonna cause issues, Many new owners would not have thought about checking that part of the gun out, for he expects it to be right. 99.995% are right but if u get one that is not and u box it up and send it back, then shame on you for now doing alittle homework urself. I have no doubt that this forum has helped literaly hundreds on new owners with piddly issues that normally a new owner without coming to this forum would have boxed the gun up and sent it back and been very unhappy about it.

but the reality is for me also is THAT NO MATTER WHAT, SOME GUNS NEED TO GO BACK. aT WHAT TIME THAT ROUND COUNT STOPS AND THE owner boxes it up and sends it back is an individual choice.. Just sayin..

[jaggedx]

Get a can of Gun Scrubber, put the plastic tube on it. Jam it in that little hole on the underneath middle section of the slide and blast it clean. Don't put any oil in it when your done cleaning it.

I could be wrong but I'd make sure the striker channel was clean and dry before anything else.

[LMT42]

I agree with Coke and think you should be patient up to four hundred rounds. I think new owners would be better served shooting no more than fifty rounds at a time, then clean and repeat. It doesn't do any good to keep running these 380s when they're dirty. It takes several outings and cleanings before they smooth out.

If the gun still won't function after 350/400 rounds, request a new recoil spring from Kahr. I'm sure they'll be glad to send one, free of charge. Give the new spring 50 rounds and if it still won't function, send it back to Kahr. IMO it's a waste of time to return it without exhausting all possibilities first.

[rogerthedodger]

I agree with Coke and think you should be patient up to four hundred rounds. I think new owners would be better served shooting no more than fifty rounds at a time, then clean and repeat. It doesn't do any good to keep running these 380s when they're dirty. It takes several outings and cleanings before they smooth out.

If the gun still won't function after 350/400 rounds, request a new recoil spring from Kahr. I'm sure they'll be glad to send one, free of charge. Give the new spring 50 rounds and if it still won't function, send it back to Kahr. IMO it's a waste of time to return it without exhausting all possibilities first.

What you say is right on, only run 50 no more than 75 rounds, then clean and lube, run another 50-75. they are tight when new, lots of lube, and spray out the striker. 200 is a minimum, but maybe 400 is more realistic for these little tight guns.
Roger

[Cokeman]

allcomments are IMO on target. My point would be after 200 rounds, really could mean nothing if progress was being made with reliability. Some guns do need more TLC to get right, some no matter what will not get right without a trip back to the factory. Who can make that decision. ONLY U THE OWNER/SHOOTER should know if ur making any real progress towards reliability. That is why I feel the propper prepping kahr is a good one to go by for a new gun. IMO if a person reads it all and goes through his gun before that first shoot and eliminates what possably could be little pcky issues, then he is way ahead of the game for that first shoot. Then after 200 rounds if progress is going backwards, I think it is time to go back. What Rogerdogger did was commendable, I would not expect any owner to go through what he went through. Undoubtely he loved the P380 enough to know that no matter how much time it took, he was going to make a good gun out of it for him. I really do think the P380 is one of the nicest guns on the market WHEN THEY WORK RIGHT. It shoots great, feels great, looks great, top quality BUT THE FOKKER MUST WORK. I must admit before the coming of kahr for me, I owqned 3 kel tecks and at the time they were about the only game in town for such a small as sultra copact 380 or 32. I wanted to love those guns to death, but after 17 times back to kel teck to get right, I finally had to face the fact that my 3 kt;'s were just never going to be reliable for me to keep. So in a way I know what Roger dogger went through, only for me it was 17 times all total. Turned out to be a total waste of my time, energy, frustration, cost

Some ownesr we know take a gun right out of the box and shoot it and if it screws up, it goes back. to me that is putting the cart before the horse. A clean gun is a good gun, Some kahrs come out of the box so full of sh-t that it is a wonder they worked through the kahr test fire even. I persnally feel every gun u buy, especially a semi auto should be throughly cleaned and lubed properly and some basic things just checked out to be sure it is all right. Good example is mag springs in backwards, its gonna cause issues, Many new owners would not have thought about checking that part of the gun out, for he expects it to be right. 99.995% are right but if u get one that is not and u box it up and send it back, then shame on you for now doing alittle homework urself. I have no doubt that this forum has helped literaly hundreds on new owners with piddly issues that normally a new owner without coming to this forum would have boxed the gun up and sent it back and been very unhappy about it.

but the reality is for me also is THAT NO MATTER WHAT, SOME GUNS NEED TO GO BACK. aT WHAT TIME THAT ROUND COUNT STOPS AND THE owner boxes it up and sends it back is an individual choice.. Just sayin..

I agree 100%.

[TriggerMan]

Explain to me how ammo is wasted by shooting it. I see people saying this all the time and just don't get it.

The premise is that you must shoot a large number of rounds to prove that a gun functions reliably before you carry it. For some thats 200 flawless FMJ rounds followed by 100 HP rounds, for others its 400 FMJ rounds followed by 20 HP rounds. YMMV

When a gun malfunctions AND later is fixed by changing a part that normally requires break-in, logically, you start your round count over. Anything shot previously does not help satisfy your personal criteria for flawless break-in. Therefore, if you know the gun is getting new parts, rounds shot before you send it in to CS are wasted.

There is one sense in which they are not wasted, if you simply enjoy shooting the gun....and your budget allows you to buy all the ammo you want.

Hope that clears it up.

[TriggerMan]

As addendum to my last post. I typically use the 300 FMJ, followed by 100 HP rule for break-in of a carry gun. First, these guns tend to be small and seem to need more break-in. Second, I do modify my own little rule by what I know of a gun.

For example, I got a replacement Sig P238 because it developed a stripped grip screw thread. I considered it ready to carry after only 200 FMJ rounds and 50 Gold Dots. I knew this model had all its bugs worked out a year earlier. It helped that it was carried mostly as a BUG.

Second, my Nano. From reading the Beretta forum, I knew that I might need 400-500 rounds to get reliable FMJ performance. To be safe, I didn't start testing SD ammo until the gun started to improve over those first 400-450 rds. I shot 100 Federal HST 124gr flawlessly and was ready to carry. I still have occasional FTEs with 115 gr FMJ ammo which is low powered. Feedback from Beretta and other owners, convinced me that the key to success was 124 gr with above average velocity.

My point is each gun is different, even within a given company and certainly across different models despite coming from the same company.

YMMV

[Cokeman]

I see your point but don't see it that way. But that's OK. Your "criteria for flawless break in" is right on. People are expecting this and get beyond pissed when it doesn't happen even though Kahr and everyone here tells them to expect issues at first. At that point the gun is a POS, the rounds were wasted, and they're going to bash the gun every time a P380 thread is started. Mine had issues at first but shooting those first 200 rounds taught me about the gun and how to shoot it well. They can replace the entire gun but can't take that away from me. I know you're giving me reasons and examples which are probably not your opinions and I'm not aiming this at you. Thanks for your explanation.

[TriggerMan]

I see your point but don't see it that way. But that's OK. Your "criteria for flawless break in" is right on. People are expecting this and get beyond pissed when it doesn't happen even though Kahr and everyone here tells them to expect issues at first. At that point the gun is a POS, the rounds were wasted, and they're going to bash the gun every time a P380 thread is started. Mine had issues at first but shooting those first 200 rounds taught me about the gun and how to shoot it well. They can replace the entire gun but can't take that away from me. I know you're giving me reasons and examples which are probably not your opinions and I'm not aiming this at you. Thanks for your explanation.

I was just explaining, although I suspected you knew what was meant by "wasted rounds". I share your opinion that getting acquainted with a new gun and how to handle malfunctions isn't wasted time, however, I have a decent ammo budget...so far. I also tend to do enough research so I go in eyes wide open, the PM9 being an exception. I should have sampled that trigger before buying one.

[Cokeman]

What do you mean about the PM9?

[cesande]

allcomments are IMO on target. My point would be after 200 rounds, really could mean nothing if progress was being made with reliability. Some guns do need more TLC to get right, some no matter what will not get right without a trip back to the factory. Who can make that decision. ONLY U THE OWNER/SHOOTER should know if ur making any real progress towards reliability. That is why I feel the propper prepping kahr is a good one to go by for a new gun. IMO if a person reads it all and goes through his gun before that first shoot and eliminates what possably could be little pcky issues, then he is way ahead of the game for that first shoot. Then after 200 rounds if progress is going backwards, I think it is time to go back. What Rogerdogger did was commendable, I would not expect any owner to go through what he went through. Undoubtely he loved the P380 enough to know that no matter how much time it took, he was going to make a good gun out of it for him. I really do think the P380 is one of the nicest guns on the market WHEN THEY WORK RIGHT. It shoots great, feels great, looks great, top quality BUT THE FOKKER MUST WORK. I must admit before the coming of kahr for me, I owqned 3 kel tecks and at the time they were about the only game in town for such a small as sultra copact 380 or 32. I wanted to love those guns to death, but after 17 times back to kel teck to get right, I finally had to face the fact that my 3 kt;'s were just never going to be reliable for me to keep. So in a way I know what Roger dogger went through, only for me it was 17 times all total. Turned out to be a total waste of my time, energy, frustration, cost

Some ownesr we know take a gun right out of the box and shoot it and if it screws up, it goes back. to me that is putting the cart before the horse. A clean gun is a good gun, Some kahrs come out of the box so full of sh-t that it is a wonder they worked through the kahr test fire even. I persnally feel every gun u buy, especially a semi auto should be throughly cleaned and lubed properly and some basic things just checked out to be sure it is all right. Good example is mag springs in backwards, its gonna cause issues, Many new owners would not have thought about checking that part of the gun out, for he expects it to be right. 99.995% are right but if u get one that is not and u box it up and send it back, then shame on you for now doing alittle homework urself. I have no doubt that this forum has helped literaly hundreds on new owners with piddly issues that normally a new owner without coming to this forum would have boxed the gun up and sent it back and been very unhappy about it.

but the reality is for me also is THAT NO MATTER WHAT, SOME GUNS NEED TO GO BACK. aT WHAT TIME THAT ROUND COUNT STOPS AND THE owner boxes it up and sends it back is an individual choice.. Just sayin..

I can NOT agree more with this post......
Do your research...
Buy what you want / need for the purpose...
Put in your time with prep and break in....
IF you have an issue take it as a challenge and go in with a positive attitude and use some mechanical prowess to meet the challenge and overcome it....
Then...
Shoot the fokker like you stole it !!!

As Jokko knows ...

NOTHING beats rounds down range .....

Wring it out ... I don't care what manufacture you are dealing with....
A trusted adviser once told me ...

If you can't make 500 trouble free rounds through it ... don't carry it....