The Long Vs the Short of it...

[kahrbrian]

This is usually the most watched and responded to forum, so I'll post here.

Do the LONGER Kahrs (barrels that is) have a better track record than the shorter ones???

I ask, because I SEEM to see more problem threads on the M types than the CX, P, etc. or the TPs.

It is also generally held that ESPECIALLY in 45, 1911s are much more reliable in the Cdr or 5" format. Something about handling cartridges in a short barrel that is challenging.

This is especially fo Kahr vets who have owned and shot plenty of Kahrs. Thanks.

[topgun1953]

I think it's more of an issue with the smaller overall package than a barrel. Less space to make things happen means tighter tolerances... My .02

[Bawanna]

I agree, it's pretty much all about tolerances. We actually hear of few habitual repeat problems these days with the exception of the 380's and it seems the majority of those are extractor tolerances when trying to shoot cheap imported ammo. The ammo really is the issue but the tolerance can be improved to run the cheap junk imported ammo.

Just a lot happening in a very small package.

[berettabone]

Ammo is always a factor.............certain firearms just work better with different ammo. It's why I've stayed away from any type of "cheap" ammo. It may have cut down on some shooting, but I respect and care about my firearms enough to just avoid problems when ever I can. The smaller firearms can have issues because of size, but I contribute at least 40-50% on shooter issues, especially not knowing that many of these smaller firearms require a death grip to function properly. That's one reason why they are not a range gun.

[ResJudicata]

With the 1911 package I believe that once you get down to the officer size the slide stroke is shorter which can cause feeding issues. Less time for the magazine to feed into the space at the top of the mag for the slide to pick up the next round.

Any shorter barrel will gun potentially have less energy feeding back to the breach face to cycle the gun. But, I wonder if it would be enough to cause a problem.

I know that with lightened slides in competition guns with light recoil springs we can have issues where the slide cycles faster than the magazine can feed similar to a gun with a shorter stroke. Also, the lower weight in the slide may not have as much mass to cycle fully with lighter loads and heavy recoil springs. The smaller guns with shorter slides will have a lighter weight slide and that might cause some of the issues.

Then again, all of the above may have nothing to do with it. As stated before, most of the problems heard about on the net are probably a combination of crappy cheap ammo, lack of user knowledge about guns and bad technique. Hard to say.

BTW, I check the slide stroke on my CM9 and TP9 and the both travel the same distance to the stop. But, the TP9 has a larger ejection port. That could make a difference for cleaner ejection.

[kahrbrian]

BTW, I check the slide stroke on my CM9 and TP9 and the both travel the same distance to the stop. But, the TP9 has a larger ejection port. That could make a difference for cleaner ejection.

I think this is ONE issue that may be significant. The port on my ST 9 is much larger overall than my PM9, The PM has a small area cutout to be as long as the PM, but if the ejection is not at a nearly perfect angle, it could easily hit the slide with no where to go. That is part of my theory at least in the Kahr for more problems with the smallest pistols.

[DJK11]

With more than 15k through two pm45 I consider it the best subcompact 45 made. Ammo is a huge factor as is proper spring maintenance. They are short stroke so weak ammo won't properly cycle the slide.

[Wlfman13]

I agree, it's pretty much all about tolerances. We actually hear of few habitual repeat problems these days with the exception of the 380's and it seems the majority of those are extractor tolerances when trying to shoot cheap imported ammo. The ammo really is the issue but the tolerance can be improved to run the cheap junk imported ammo.

Just a lot happening in a very small package.

Please re-read Bawannna’s reply. With Kahrs, any issue seems to be in the “tolerances”. In this case, the space between the ejector and the breech-face. It only takes .015mm to make a difference. Seriously! I have measured it via a digital caliper.

So, pick the platform/size that works for you, and then find the right ammo for it. Follow Jocko’s break-in advice (hand-rack 400-500 times).

The self-defense stuff will shoot (Hornady Critical Defense, Corbon Pow’r Ball, etc,). They seem to all have thin rims.

-Wlfs

[kahrbrian]

For what it is worth, I believe length of slide has some relationship to 'issues' in the models. Provable? - likely NOT. But I know that my ST 9 is easy to rack and rack rounds into the chamber. It just feels smooth and easy almost like other guns. Not so with my PM9 which is very reliable, but harder to rack, etc. Picked up a CW9 in a shop the other day - hard to rack AND its slide stop was HARD to activate. Much of this was due to the tension on the slide and recoil spring.

[kenemoore]

From Newtonian physics we get Force=Mass x acceleration.
If the recoil from a 9mm round is a constant force and the smaller slides have less mass, then we must have more acceleration. To dampen this increased acceleration we have heavier springs, and heavier springs means harder to rack slides.