CM9 Accuracy Issues

[dfborn]

Ok. Here's the deal. I know, and agree, that more likely than not an accuracy issue is going to be shooter rather than firearm related. I also know that even people who know that, think that they're an exception. Well, I'm no different. Here's the thing:

I bought the Kahr after being a Sig only guy because of it's size and I didn't like the SAO 938/238s. First time out, the trigger took some getting used to, but it wasn't that different from the first round DA pull from the Sigs. My wife and I enjoyed the first time out with it immensely and both of us did well shooting at 5.5" Orange Peel targets from CCW distances.

Since then, I feel like the accuracy has only gotten worse. The only change that was made to the firearm, other than being broken-in, is that I replaced the front sight with a night sight. Recently, I took it out to test some reloads and couldn't hit anything. I assumed that maybe they were just too hot and that was the problem, but today I took it out with WWB and couldn't hit an 8.5"x11" piece of paper from about 15 ft away.

By the way, I hate the bar-dot style sights so I just line the top of the front sight with the top of the rear sight. I emailed Kahr to ask if the Trijicon front sight in conjunction with the standard bar rear sight and they said: "We are not sure if the current combination of sights would be an issue or not. the height of the Trijicon rear sight is the same as the height of the standard day sight."

I bought a Lasermax for it as well, but haven't really tried to use it yet because I want to get it worked out with the irons first.

Also, I don't think it's that I've declined in general as a shooter, I'm still doing well with every other firearm we own.

Any suggestions?

[RRP]

Dry practice is extremely beneficial, if you are disciplined enough to do it.

[dfborn]

I hear ya, and did quite a bit today before I went to the range. Even did some with the laser on to make sure I wasn't jerking it.

[deadeye]

Must be something in the mods causing it as it was fine before. Once I figured out the trigger mine has been dead on for 3 years. No mods. However I am not that good. 3" pattern at 25'. Also, however I am 71 years old with failing eyesight and arthritis. (Excuses!)

[yqtszhj]

Is it consistently bad in one direction high or low since the sight replacement, or all over the place?

I'm an oddball and like the bar dot sights. Even put them on another gun too.

[dfborn]

Is it consistently bad in one direction high or low since the sight replacement, or all over the place?

It seems all over the place. But I need to get out again soon with a BIG piece of paper to know for sure.

[muggsy]

Buy some snap caps. Have someone load a magazine with a mix of live rounds and snap caps in no particular order. Then you shoot the gun and you'll find out very quickly if it's you or the gun. Another alternative is to find someone who is familiar with Kahr firearms and have them shoot your gun. At 21 feet you should be able to keep all of your shots within the confines of a 3" orange target paster.

[jocko]

listen to Muggsy, he took the words right out of my ass. He is right in what he is saying. It ain't thegun I haveover 34K rounds thru my PMJ9 and I am not a good shot but at 7 yardsj, I am still not a good shot. Kahrs are not the easiest to shoot in the same hole or for me even near the same hold. All of my targets are one shot targets, just looks so much better pinned on my wall when people see it, they don't know. Practice does not make perfect but perfect practice does. keep at it and u will figure it out. don't compare it to any single action weapon or IMO to even a glock. That looooong but totallysmoth kahr trigger is awesome but frustrating tomany. I can attest that my glock 43 shoots circles around my PMJ9, but I know who is at fault to. I accept it,. Ican keep every shot in the bowling pin FBI silhouette target at 7 yards, certainly no 3"groups but they are all i there4. That is all I care about. U have a great gun, IMO the best pcket carry gun u cn ever buy, but lso IMO if your gonna waiste band carry it, then IMO there are other alittel bigger 9's out there tht will let you shoot them better. The glock 43 is one of them, IMO...

the snap cap thing is IMO the best idea and muggsy hit it right. dry firing is OK but you never get that bang thing either and that is what separates the men from the sheep.. the trouble with flinching and jerking is that this all happens at the same time the BNG thing happens, sop u really never see or fell that happening but if a mysterious snap cap comes along , trust me, you will convince aqnd show urself that, yup I need to work more on my shooting..

[kwh]

Be sure the front sight is tight and did not move.

[CJB]

couldn't hit an 8.5"x11" piece of paper from about 15 ft away.

Lets do the math.

Sight radius - I'd have to measure but lets say 5.25 inches.
Distance from center of paper to nearest edge is 4.25 inches
Distance from front sight to paper is 180 inches

You'd have to move the the front or rear sight .124 inches (close enough to 1/8 inch) to miss the edge of the paper

Assuming the sights are CENTERED, you'd have be about .160 inches "off" to miss the top or bottom of the paper. You can't go .160 low with the front sight, so is you're new front sight something over a quarter inch tall?

If not, its all you, sir!

Sights can be adjusting by using a hammer to hit a punch that moves the sight, when the slide is securely fastened in a sturdy vice.

In your case... I suspect we'll have to crunch your trigger finger a bit in a vice, than just hit it directly with a hammer a few times while still in the vice. That oughta make you think about where your hittin'!

[pbagley]

Good stuff already said above. I have only one thing to add: If you want better accuracy then you should buy a CM40. I have both. The CM9 is not as accurate. Both are the same size and I can use the same holsters with either. If I take them both to the range the CM40 always prints a better group. Always. The down side is that the CM40 kicks a bit more. Keep your thumbs in check or you may drop the magazine or lock the slide back.

Good luck.

[muggsy]

Lets do the math.

Sight radius - I'd have to measure but lets say 5.25 inches.
Distance from center of paper to nearest edge is 4.25 inches
Distance from front sight to paper is 180 inches

You'd have to move the the front or rear sight .124 inches (close enough to 1/8 inch) to miss the edge of the paper

Assuming the sights are CENTERED, you'd have be about .160 inches "off" to miss the top or bottom of the paper. You can't go .160 low with the front sight, so is you're new front sight something over a quarter inch tall?

If not, its all you, sir!

Sights can be adjusting by using a hammer to hit a punch that moves the sight, when the slide is securely fastened in a sturdy vice.

In your case... I suspect we'll have to crunch your trigger finger a bit in a vice, than just hit it directly with a hammer a few times while still in the vice. That oughta make you think about where your hittin'!

If he's all over the paper adjusting the sights won't help a thing. I'm betting that it's in his grip or that he's anticipating recoil. A small handgun with a short sight radius isn't the easiest gun in the world to shoot. The long DAO trigger takes time to master. If the barrel is clean and everything is tight the problem is the shooter.

[jocko]

Good stuff already said above. I have only one thing to add: If you want better accuracy then you should buy a CM40. I have both. The CM9 is not as accurate. Both are the same size and I can use the same holsters with either. If I take them both to the range the CM40 always prints a better group. Always. The down side is that the CM40 kicks a bit more. Keep your thumbs in check or you may drop the magazine or lock the slide back.

Good luck.

the accuracy of the two caliers, to me makes no sense. Maybe your particulartwo guns is showing a difference, but think about it for a second. Just sayin

[berettabone]

Good stuff already said above. I have only one thing to add: If you want better accuracy then you should buy a CM40. I have both. The CM9 is not as accurate. Both are the same size and I can use the same holsters with either. If I take them both to the range the CM40 always prints a better group. Always. The down side is that the CM40 kicks a bit more. Keep your thumbs in check or you may drop the magazine or lock the slide back.

Good luck.

I shoot mostly .40 cal...............................I seem to be the most accurate with that caliber, regardless of firearm used. I have had others tell me the same thing. The snap of the .40 round seems to get me back on target a lot quicker.

[CJB]

If he's all over the paper adjusting the sights won't help a thing. I'm betting that it's in his grip or that he's anticipating recoil. A small handgun with a short sight radius isn't the easiest gun in the world to shoot. The long DAO trigger takes time to master. If the barrel is clean and everything is tight the problem is the shooter.

Muggs..... You failed to read BETWEEN my lines.