Range Report - PM45

[jocko]

A GLOCKSTER WILL NOT BUY THAT CRAPOLA..Just ask um!!

[wyntrout]

I've had many "customers" at my garage sales proudly show me their KelTecs... usually in those tacky "fanny packs" sometimes sporting the KelTec Logo, and until I got my first polymer Kahr, I tried handling one at the local gun shows and checking out the prices... many, many times, but I could never "pull the trigger" and buy one. They just didn't look or feel good to me... not quality and not enough big gun features. I stuck with my SS Walther TPH .22 which weighs a tiny bit more than the P380 loaded! I had a K9... too big and heavy, and an Interarms SS Walther PPK/S, which was kind of heavy and liked to bite the web of my hand and tended to DOUBLE sometimes with the light SA trigger. I would be trying to get my finger re-situated between shots and kaboom! At least it was downrange!
That slide was sharp and low... really had to concentrate on not getting "bit".

The K9, I couldn't really shoot that well, either, but after lots of practice with the polymers, and a bit more with the K9, I was finally shooting it a lot better. The big trick is shooting a lot and often. I went 3 to 5 years... not sure... without shooting anything, well other than my BB or pellet guns. I really got going and joined the Gun Gallery range here on Beach Blvd February of last year after getting a LNIB PM9 DLC with NS at the local gun show. I must have fired over 6K rounds since then. I don't keep records of rounds fired, but I was able to compute over 2,200 rounds in the PM45 before it got a new frame... in about 5 months! And that didn't include Kahr's test firing. More shooting really helps... especially since all of the Kahrs are similar in function and controls!
I'm overdue testing the Herters .380 FMJ I got for the range and will test that and the new 7-round mags when I get them.

My range trips are productions... getting all of the stuff gathered up loaded into my range case... guns, ammo, magazines, loaders, ear protection, eye-protection, camera, more ammo, some tools and cleaning supplies... and so on... plus get a cardboard target and paper plates marked up. I reinforce the top middle of the cardboard and tape on a twine or wirewrap tie to put over the clamp on the pulley system at the range. I don't like my targets falling off downrange! They don't allow you to recover them!

It seems to take half a day to get ready... and then 200-250 rounds on a short trip, go so quickly! But it's sure fun!

Wynn

[lliden]

Hi Folks. Jay from Kahr contacted me today. Don't know if he was watching this forum, or saw my comments when I registered the warranty of my PM45. But impressed that he reached out nonetheless.

He is sending me a new slide stop to see if that resolves the problem feeding the Speer Gold Dot 230 grain ammo. And I'll try some 185 grain hollowpoints and pass him my results. I'll let you know what happens over the next week...

[jocko]

indeed beyond the call of duty..

[HeyGuysWatchThis]

Hi Folks. Jay from Kahr contacted me today. Don't know if he was watching this forum, or saw my comments when I registered the warranty of my PM45. But impressed that he reached out nonetheless.

He is sending me a new slide stop to see if that resolves the problem feeding the Speer Gold Dot 230 grain ammo. And I'll try some 185 grain hollowpoints and pass him my results. I'll let you know what happens over the next week...

Did he respond to the FMJ only angle?

[Bawanna]

Hi Folks. Jay from Kahr contacted me today. Don't know if he was watching this forum, or saw my comments when I registered the warranty of my PM45. But impressed that he reached out nonetheless.

He is sending me a new slide stop to see if that resolves the problem feeding the Speer Gold Dot 230 grain ammo. And I'll try some 185 grain hollowpoints and pass him my results. I'll let you know what happens over the next week...

Outstanding. Jolly good of him to do that. Call me impressed to the extreme.

[Michael W.]

Hi Folks. Jay from Kahr contacted me today. Don't know if he was watching this forum, or saw my comments when I registered the warranty of my PM45. But impressed that he reached out nonetheless.

He is sending me a new slide stop to see if that resolves the problem feeding the Speer Gold Dot 230 grain ammo. And I'll try some 185 grain hollowpoints and pass him my results. I'll let you know what happens over the next week...

When I was breaking in my PM45 besides FMJ I ran both Remington Golden Sabres and Federal 230gr HST's through mine without any issues.

The 230gr Golden Sabres usually are lifesaver with finicky 45's that you want to carry defensive load in. (Like every Kimber I ever owned
With their very rounded ogive they feed like ball but have some
impressive terminal effects. They're also easy to find.

Currently riding in my PM45 are the 230 Gr Federal HST's.
They were really tough to get for a long time but lately they seem
plentiful . Give them a try, 230 Gr HST is this generation's
"Flying Ashtray". In just about every caliber it's got some very dramatic
expansion without sacrificing expansion.

M-

[lliden]

Thanks Michael. I tried the Golden Sabres, and they did not feed in my PM45 as reliably as FMJ. I'll see if I can find HSTs around town, and give them a run. My 185 grain order should be in before the weekend, and I'll try them too: Hornady Critical Defense & Winchester Silvertip.

[Michael W.]

Thanks Michael. I tried the Golden Sabres, and they did not feed in my PM45 as reliably as FMJ. I'll see if I can find HSTs around town, and give them a run. My 185 grain order should be in before the weekend, and I'll try them too: Hornady Critical Defense & Winchester Silvertip.

Wow, thats the first time I've heard of Sabre's not feeding.
Could be the OAL might be interfering.

I don't recall if you mentioned earlier in this thread if you've searched up
some of the older posts re: the PM45 feed issues? Have you checked
your gun for the "feedstrip bevel" issue?

The PM45 is really a feat of engineering when you stop and consider how
compact it trully is. The whole line of Kahr guns are but I think the PM45
is really the pinnacle of what Kahr has been able to do with
downsizing the overall package. The downside is much tighter tolerances
and perhaps more unforgiving of ammo choices.

But then, I'm of the opinion that in .45 ACP ANY modern hollowpoint
will do the job adequately.

Re: Federal HST, if you don't find it locally ATG has them (although pricey)

http://www.ammunitiontogo.com/produc...low-point-ammo

I use the standard pressure 230gr not the +P variant.

Good luck to you!

M-

[lliden]

Range update: I shot a few boxes of Corbon 185 grain hollowpoints, Winchster Silvertiop, and Hornady Critical defense, also 185 grain. All fed flawlessly. But I had some light primer strikes on the Silvertips, 2 out of 50. And the Corbon's kicked my ass with their recoil and muzzle blast. So far, the Hornady Critical Defense seem to be the best combination of reliable feeding and managable recoil.

[wyntrout]

I've put probably 3,000+ rounds through my PM45, or the collective "Franken-Boomer". No particular round gave me problems. I prefer 230-grain standard rounds... JHP and FMJ... the same weight and general ballistics. I don't see excessive recoil and don't feel the need for +P with the 230-grain loads.
For defense, I used Golden Sabers and then Bonded Golden Sabers... better penetration. BJHP stands for Brass Jacketed Hollow Points, confusing some people, even one dealer that I corrected. When it became difficult to get the Bonded GS, I switched to Speer Gold Dot Short Barrel which are bonded, as well, and designed for... short barreled pistols like the PM45. I also bought a bunch of the regular Gold Dots for my longer barreled .45's. I like the GDs and the Bonded GS... all in 230-grain sizes.
Both of those rounds have jacketing at the tip to preclude the lead from increasing friction in loading... problematic in some with exposed lead at the tip that does contact the feed ramp.
The GDs are really different between the regular and the Short Barrel, with the latter having cavity that is about 0.1" shallower and wider at the bottom of the cavity than the standard GDs.
My post and flash testing the GDs and GDSB:

http://kahrtalk.com/showthread.php?t=7147

Wynn

[TheTman]

My friend with the 3.5" barrel Kimber was told by the smith at the gun store he bought it from, that 185 gr bullets perform better from short barrel .45s, like his Kimber and Kahrs, than the 230 gr, usually do. Having less mass gets them moving quicker with an increase in FPS/FPE over most 230gr loads. I can see the logic in that. Both weights are going to leave the same size entry wound, what happens from there, depends on how well the bullet performs. I've heard that the 230 gr Hydra Shoks perform better at lower velocities than many other HP designs, so I would like to try those out on some wet newspaper with a layer or two of denim covering it, but they are very scarce around here right now. I do have some standard 230 Gold Dots, and some 185 gr +P Golden Sabre that I want to test too. Probably should pick up a box of the short barrel Gold Dots and see how they compare to the standard load. Will try the PDX1 from Walmart too, and maybe take a run down to Gander Mountain and pick up some different brands. Gonna have to wait until I get the farm back, but that should happen pretty soon. Not supposed to fire anything but shotguns out there now, but if I do it in the barn with the doors closed on a week day, no body should be close enough to tell what was being shot if the even hear anything at all. If I do it on a windy day chances are no one will hear anything anyway. I take a shotgun and shoot it once so if the cops do come out I have that to show them I was shooting a shotgun. I've done that several times in the past and never had a complaint, or any cops show up.

[wyntrout]

Opinions are cheap and everybody has one... or two... or a bunch! Some people spout stuff like that just to say something "authoritatively", usually to a neophyte who's lead astray by the "expert". I haven't done any penetration testing, but a lot HAS been done by "bubbas", and experts and posted online. So the information is there... factory, magazine and gun experts alike. There's federal and other LE agency tests, too, including videos. And there are tests like the Ballistics by the Inch:
http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/index.html

Where a few guys got together and did some really great testing with a ton of ammo and cutting off barrels for a lot of calibers in testing the effect of barrel length on velocity and energy. It's very informative with actual real everyday pistols as well, including updates late last year for the most popular .380 ACP's, among them the Kahr P380.

Wynn

[dwordinger@netzero.net]

I've shot Remington 185 grain Golden Saber 45 ACP +P, and as a few others have already commented, they work great. I usually practice with something less expensive, but my magazines for carry and self defense are loaded with Golden Sabers.

[Exclr8]

I am using Horandy custom 200gr xtp rounds without problem.