Open carry rant

[JohnR]

Decorum. Unless a person likes self-righteous AR-15 fans painted into Norman Rockwell scenes. Lordy I hope we don't adopt that as a new American norm, or truly the terrorists will have won by turning us into a paranoid, polarized and militarized nation.

I respectfully disagree.





With what ISIS is doing, we damn well better turn into a militarized nation.

[Longitude Zero]

.

It is clear to me that most gun owners desire only the appearance of liberty. The behavior of many posters in this thread reveals how fractured our side is and how we are willing to politically ostracize those we do not like. Many of us are not willing to work with such people in an attempt to influence their behavior. Fortunately, organizations such as VCDL exist to counteract this behavior because they will work with any reasonable person while working on the Virginia legislature. Their numbers are also suppressed because of gun owners who refuse to come together in common cause (it only has around 3,000 paid members in a state with hundreds of thousands CHP holders).

Look at the behavior of the Republican party today. They were given a very powerful mandate on the ACA, guns and immigration. We helped put them there and they have funded the ACA and all but given up on illegal immigration. Mark Levine noted recently that the party is acting like it lost. Michael Bane pointed out in his blog that we have significantly influenced many elections over the past two decades, but have received very little in return from Republicans. They forget us the moment the election party ends. They can afford to since we do not know what we want as a group and refuse to speak as one loud voice. As a group, we are selfish assholes who don't work well together. Why would the Republican party follow through for us when we act like this and they can get our votes for free?

This is more of the If a right is not exercised it is lost tripe. Discretion is almost always the better part of valor. You can legally drive a car with your feet but it is incredibly stupid to do so. In case you have not noticed the number of guns sold is at record numbers oh yeah and here is an educated newsflash that the number of anti-firearms laws proposed and passed is at historic lows. The antis' are being turned back in droves because of concerted and inclusive efforts. They have had such non existent effect nationally and on statewide basis they are going to each individual town and city to get traction. I have no clue what you are looking at but the so called schism you mentioned is illusory and imaginary.

[berettabone]

IF some of these rifle carrying 2nd amendment people were serious, professional, tactful , concerned, respectful people, I can agree with their statements and their public responses.............but 80% of these people, when you see or talk to them, are the same people you view on the TV, and say, WTF????????????

[Longitude Zero]

IF some of these rifle carrying 2nd amendment people were serious, professional, tactful , concerned, respectful people, I can agree with their statements and their public responses.............but 80% of these people, when you see or talk to them, are the same people you view on the TV, and say, WTF????????????

Exactly!

[Bawanna]

I see the same thing at our gun shows. The way some of them dress and act just really don't do anything to help any sort of pro gun effort.

I trip them up quite frequently, I sometimes dress up sort of business casual, I don't go so far as to wear a tie or nothing insane like that but nice dress clothes (at least by my standards).

The 350lb dudes with the boonie hats and camo pants down to their knees don't do anything to make us look good.

[b4uqzme]

I see the same thing at our gun shows. The way some of them dress and act just really don't do anything to help any sort of pro gun effort.

I trip them up quite frequently, I sometimes dress up sort of business casual, I don't go so far as to wear a tie or nothing insane like that but nice dress clothes (at least by my standards).

The 350lb dudes with the boonie hats and camo pants down to their knees don't do anything to make us look good.

Well said! Same goes for pretty much all of life IMHO.

[ScottM]

Discretion is almost always the better part of valor.

You sir, are at risk for being called insightful.

We have a gun range/store near me that's clean, brightly lit, has nice restrooms, has friendly staff great at fielding beginner questions, holds women-only classes on self-defense and introduction to shooting, and you see people of all races, genders, religions and political proclivities there, even folks who never grew up around guns. It's great, and I've met so many people who got their start with firearms there, including a few that I started. That place does so much to legitimize gun ownership.

Contrast that with a range just north of me that shut down last year. They had a long-standing reputation for being darkly lit, poorly ventilated, dirty shelves and bathrooms, and grumpy with newcomers, not to mention condescending and downright leery towards women. I went there by myself, but rarely with girlfriends or beginners because I didn't want my friends to feel like they were walking into a scary underculture that viewed them with almost a fanatical contempt.

I think that's exactly the kind of comparison we're drawing here. Dirty, frothy tacticools slinging AKs at a genteel coffee shop don't make most people comfortable, least of not when they're carrying kids who aren't yet ready to glimpse the world's gnarly bits. Typical folks, when later presented with gun laws, will remember how they felt the last time they saw that gun in person - rudely imposed upon and possibly downright scared at their favorite Java joint.

I once overheard a political strategist say "faced with the choice of feeling righteous or feeling effective, I'll take effective every time." I think it comes down to what we as gun owners truly want to accomplish with the general public. Self-righteous indignation in the face of our political enemies, or effective acceptance and even support of sensible rationale.

[Longitude Zero]

You sir, are at risk for being called insightful.

I once overheard a political strategist say "faced with the choice of feeling righteous or feeling effective, I'll take effective every time." I think it comes down to what we as gun owners truly want to accomplish with the general public. Self-righteous indignation in the face of our political enemies, or effective acceptance and even support of sensible rationale.

Thanks and perish the thought of insight, LOL. Your analogy is perfect and spot on. An old politician told me something similar. He said, I will let you write legislation and I will wright the rules of procedure and beat you and your legislation every time.

[ltxi]

^^^^...x2

[knkali]

This is more of the If a right is not exercised it is lost tripe. Discretion is almost always the better part of valor. You can legally drive a car with your feet but it is incredibly stupid to do so. In case you have not noticed the number of guns sold is at record numbers oh yeah and here is an educated newsflash that the number of anti-firearms laws proposed and passed is at historic lows. The antis' are being turned back in droves because of concerted and inclusive efforts. They have had such non existent effect nationally and on statewide basis they are going to each individual town and city to get traction. I have no clue what you are looking at but the so called schism you mentioned is illusory and imaginary.

doesn't seem so where I am from---Kalifornia. Sales are high but the DOJ approval of guns for sale here is dwindling away.

[Longitude Zero]

Sales are high but the DOJ approval of guns for sale here is dwindling away.

Troubling and sadly true.

[el_presidente]

I am not opposed to open-carry. I do not support, however, organized open-carry rallies where people sling long guns and target businesses merely to make a point about their rights. I think these rallies are counter-productive to our efforts to protect the second amendment. And, I have sometimes wondered whose side they are really representing.

perfectly said.

[tomrkba]

Open carry in Arkansas as a political tool worked and it now appears that the state has constitutional carry:

http://www.ammoland.com/2015/02/cont...al-carry-over/

I would love to know the story of what went on behind the scenes. I am sure people worked long and hard to get the clarification passed. This seems to me to be the way that works since it has worked here in Virginia (more as a defense against bad laws) and other states. The OC movement appears to need a political arm in addition to an activist component. They compliment each other and individuals can operate in either or both, as they see fit.

[tv_racin_fan]

Trouble is in many of these states where people have carried long guns the open carry of a handgun is illegal but the open carry of a long gun is legal. They are protesting the absurdity of the laws in relation to the second amendment. There was a time when only those who had nefarious intent concealed a handgun.

As someone else pointed out it is amazing how many who profess to support the second amendment who don't actually seem to believe the words therein. Seems to me you either believe the right is not to be infringed or you don't. In my opinion forcing me to conceal carry is an infringement no different than forcing me to get a permit to carry is. Perhaps one day some will get their wish and only the musket will be legal to keep and bear, I imagine those same people will be shocked when I walk in with a brace of sea service pistols hanging off my belt.

[CPTKILLER]

Say what you like. I'm going on one at 3:00 PM here in Austin, Texas at SXSW!

In Texas, we are working hard to bring this about.