LEO stops for OC in CA

[MLESa7990]

What do you do when the law requires you to retreat? Be real, no internet tough guy BS, OK? Serious question on a serious topic.

^^^^This

[TriggerMan]

I don't get it.

... some of us just happen to be more comfortable at times carrying openly.

A late additional thought. Sorry for the split posts.

Wasn't it Col. Jeff Cooper who said, "Carrying a gun isn't supposed to be comfortable. It's supposed to be comforting".

Have a nice day everyone. I sense this thread will get locked soon. All the issues have been covered in this thread and in one closed yesterday.

[MLESa7990]

I wanna hear back from muggsy first. Hopefully it stays open a bit longer!

[muggsy]

What do you do when the law requires you to retreat? Be real, no internet tough guy BS, OK? Serious question on a serious topic.

If the law requires me to retreat, I retreat. I'm a law abiding citizen. If it is my right to openly carry, I call the police and have them set the neanderthal straight.

[muggsy]

I wanna hear back from muggsy first. Hopefully it stays open a bit longer!

I hope that I didn't disappoint you MLES. Everyone is entitled to an opinion. It's my opinion that you don't retain your rights if you constantly retreat from them. The left has been chipping away at our rights for far too long.

[Bawanna]

A late additional thought. Sorry for the split posts.

Wasn't it Col. Jeff Cooper who said, "Carrying a gun isn't supposed to be comfortable. It's supposed to be comforting".

Have a nice day everyone. I sense this thread will get locked soon. All the issues have been covered in this thread and in one closed yesterday.

That's actually a Clint Smith quote but both guys totally rock!

[Longitude Zero]

The left has been chipping away at our rights for far too long.

And way too often extreme right wing zealots/neandertals/idiots/buffoons give the lefties all the ammunition they need to shoot us in the foot. The phrase "You are your own worst enemy" comes to mind here.

[Bawanna]

I hope that I didn't disappoint you MLES. Everyone is entitled to an opinion. It's my opinion that you don't retain your rights if you constantly retreat from them. The left has been chipping away at our rights for far too long.

Actually far worse than the left chipping at our rights is the fact that open carry has become socially unacceptable in many if not most locations. There are of course exceptions. It's very difficult to once again program folks unaccustomed to seeing guns in the open to accept that it is ok.

Even in the old west many towns made you turn in your guns when in town.

I just don't see how we can reprogram people to accept the fact that it is ok. Even if we make them understand that it is perfectly legal they still aren't gonna be comfortable with it. They will call police, police will have to respond, a vicious circle. Those who legitimately do it like the trip hunting scenarios in certain area's again are probably gonna be ok. Those who do it to instigate and retrain (I love it when they say they are training the cops) are gonna create a scenario where the Open Carry law is gonna go away.

It's a sad deal really but it is what it is.

This thread is hanging on by a thread but I'm making the full 8 second ride. Let er buck!

[tv_racin_fan]

The solution to your self created problem (7 1/2 inch or 8 inch barrel) is to carry an appropriate concealement weapon. It isn't for us to find you a holster.

Why pray tell would I carry a smaller handgun when going hunting? and just for the record I do carry a smaller concealed handgun when I go out.

At least you recognize OC isn't for everywhere (downtown Burbank). We're making progress. Pray for the gun enthusiats in California. They just lost their right to OC effective January 1. Seems OC alienated the public. Is that where you want GA to go? Thought not. Give it some thought. Carry on.

I don't have a problem.. and I already have a suitable for me holster for both the ROA and the 1858. Trouble is they aint suitable for you and your ilk because they can be seen.

You catch the latest TV ad for the Next American Idol? Care to tell me what handgun the holster Steven Tyler has on is made for? Guess he shouldn't be open carrying that on a National TV ad...

[TriggerMan]

I don't have a problem.. and I already have a suitable for me holster for both the ROA and the 1858. Trouble is they aint suitable for you and your ilk because they can be seen.

You catch the latest TV ad for the Next American Idol? Care to tell me what handgun the holster Steven Tyler has on is made for? Guess he shouldn't be open carrying that on a National TV ad...

Not a big Steven Tyler fan and stopped watching Cowboys and Indians on TV about 50 years ago.

As to whether your holster is suitable (for "my ilk"--who talks like that?), you brought up that it wasn't suitable when you asked the members here to name a suitable holster. Further, no one is saying to hunt with a CCW weapon. Stick your 8 inch barell handgun in the truck until you get to the proper hunting area. Simple enough?

You don't see the danger to yourself from OC. You are clearly in the minority here. You ignore the danger to all your gun rights (AB 144 was signed into law. Open Carry will be illegal in CA effective Jan 1, 2012). You aren't any different than the guys on YouTube who don't have a clue about Public Relations. I've given you rational reasons for the superiority of CC. Many others have as well. Turn a blind eye at your own peril.

[TriggerMan]

If the law requires me to retreat, I retreat. I'm a law abiding citizen. If it is my right to openly carry, I call the police and have them set the neanderthal straight.

So your snide "turn tail" comments were just trolling? Use more smiley faces next time.

[tv_racin_fan]

I think when you open carry your just asking for attention and trouble. You can't use the dam thing unless your confronted with deadly force. For instance you strut into Bob Evans wearing that gun and some dad (1 foot and 100 lbs bigger than you) gets up in your face and maybe even starts ***** slapping you around in front of your wife. What are you going to do? You can't pull the dam gun, he's unarmed... Maybe you loose your temper and pull the gun to threated him. You still can't legally shoot him. And if he grabs it from you, he can pistol whip you or possibly even shoot you in self defense. Or the other possibility, you shoot an unarmed man. Now you really in trouble. So explain to what's the point of open carry, other that getting attention?

"Poor fool gonna get a surprise ifn he done fooled with my wifes man. She gon pull her handgun outn her purse and stick it up in his nostril.. then she gon politely tell him to let her man alone while the son done got on his cell phone and done called da law."

Actully I can pull my handgun and in fact I can shoot him ifn he has attempted to hit me or my wife. Now ifn I do or not is gonna depend on the exact circumstances but I aint going to stand there and get my head beat in because some fool thinks I aint allowed to defend myself regardless of how I might be carrying a handgun that particular day.

Now see them boys that goes out open carrying and hoping for some conflict might well get what they want and they might even cause some fool politician to think he needs to put an end to the right to open carry. Kinda like some folk think politicians need to put an end to the right to carry period because they somehow think if they prevent law abiding citizens from keeping and bearing firearms criminals wont keep nor bear them either.

I full well understand that when I do open carry someone might get concerned and call the law. The leo will more than likely show up and either see what it is I am carrying and comment on what it is I am doing and send me on my way out hunting or he will ask me what it is I am doing and since I will respond politely that I am going on about my business he may inform me that it is a might silly to open carry or he might just send me on about my way.

Seems to me it is all about the intent and actions of the person doing the open carrying.

[tv_racin_fan]

Not a big Steven Tyler fan and stopped watching Cowboys and Indians on TV about 50 years ago.

As to whether your holster is suitable (for "my ilk"--who talks like that?), you brought up that it wasn't suitable when you asked the members here to name a suitable holster. Further, no one is saying to hunt with a CCW weapon. Stick your 8 inch barell handgun in the truck until you get to the proper hunting area. Simple enough?

No it isn't simple enough. YOU can leave your handgun in the truck if you like and you can stand out in the parking lot taking off your holster so you can leave it in the truck as well if you like. The law is very clear and I am fully within my right to wear my holster and my handgun into Waffle House to have breakfast or at the Quickie Mart to get gas and a soda or at Walmart to grab whatever it is I might want to grab.

You don't see the danger to yourself from OC. You are clearly in the minority here. You ignore the danger to all your gun rights (AB 144 was signed into law. Open Carry will be illegal in CA effective Jan 1, 2012). You aren't any different than the guys on YouTube who don't have a clue about Public Relations. I've given you rational reasons for the superiority of CC. Many others have as well. Turn a blind eye at your own peril.

There is danger in waking up in the morning.. danger in walking outside.. danger in drving my car. I see all of those dangers but I wont shrink back into my shell to avoid them.

There are rational reasons for both styles of carry... pros and cons. I do not ignore nor dismiss either.

[Longitude Zero]

There are rational reasons for both styles of carry... pros and cons. I do not ignore nor dismiss either.

Please list just one con for CCW that mainstream CCW'rs admit is viable. About the only reason that I am not a fan of open carry is my familiarity of the bad guys OODA Loop. You can google it and read the summations yourself.

But basically with OC you give up the element of surprise. There is NO emperical evidence that I have ever seen that OC stopped or prevented a crime since the bad guys rarely speak about it and NO valid research has been accomplished. It would be my estimation that if a BG was intent upon pulling a job and he/she sees an OC then as the BG I would smoke the OC'er first to eleminate an obvious threat.

BY uitilizing OC you give up threat identification to the bad guy and give him/her a 1.6-4.8 second time advantage. Will some less experienced BG's leave when they see open carry, yes it is true. FBI research into officer involved shootings proves that an experienced BG will NOT be turned away by the mere presence of a gun.

Far too many folks believe a gun is what deters bad events. Those people are 100% WRONG!!! What deters bad events is a weapon in the hand of someone the BG realizes has the WILL TO USE IT.

[tv_racin_fan]

Please list just one con for CCW that mainstream CCW'rs admit is viable. About the only reason that I am not a fan of open carry is my familiarity of the bad guys OODA Loop. You can google it and read the summations yourself.

But basically with OC you give up the element of surprise. There is NO emperical evidence that I have ever seen that OC stopped or prevented a crime since the bad guys rarely speak about it and NO valid research has been accomplished. It would be my estimation that if a BG was intent upon pulling a job and he/she sees an OC then as the BG I would smoke the OC'er first to eleminate an obvious threat.

What you might do has little to no bearing on the issue. What the bad guys did was they sent in a bad guy to case the joint.. he spotted two good ole boys openly carrying handguns.. they bad guys decided to wait out the good ole boys... observant officer spotted the bad guys auto around back and when he investigated he arrested said bad guys... bad guys admitted they didn't committ the crime they had intended to committ because of the good ole boys and their openly carried handguns.

http://www.examiner.com/gun-rights-i...bbery-kennesaw

BY uitilizing OC you give up threat identification to the bad guy and give him/her a 1.6-4.8 second time advantage. Will some less experienced BG's leave when they see open carry, yes it is true. FBI research into officer involved shootings proves that an experienced BG will NOT be turned away by the mere presence of a gun.

Far too many folks believe a gun is what deters bad events. Those people are 100% WRONG!!! What deters bad events is a weapon in the hand of someone the BG realizes has the WILL TO USE IT.

You believe what you like how you like and you carry whatever firearm you like how you like.