Econo SD loads

[Captquest]

Back in my day we used to walk seventeen miles through mosquito infested swamps to get our ammo. And we didn't even care!!
And all that was available for defense was Winchester Sivertips, and we loved it!!
OK, enough of my grumpy old man bit.
I did like those rounds and did a lot of DIY testing with them. Well, all I hear now is they're obsolete, there are much better loads available, They are inferior. So I Googled .40 Sivertip Masaad Ayoob to see if he has weighed in on them recently, he was an advocate of them at one time. I found this (the info for .40 S&W is on page two).
http://www.tactical-life.com/gear/de.../#.Uruz1613t1N
And then a search on YT didn't have much, but this was a good test.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xSFekTa7uQ


Hey, I'm all about not wasting money unnecessarily, and these sell at Walmart for just a bit more than regular "white box" stuff. I could afford to run a couple of hundred through my gun to prove their reliability. And come on, anything coming out of that cannon is gonna hurt, but I believe they might be a very effective round. I like the idea of the bonded loads (PDX1) I'm using now too since I drive a lot and would like to know I can get through my glass window and still do the job. Maybe I'll mix 'em up, my mags are like a box of chocolates...
I

[muggsy]

Great article. I've always been far more impressed with real world results that ballistic gel tests. I can't remember the last time that I was attacked by ballistic gel wearing a denim jacket. Having said that gel test do give good comparative information and it is rather difficult to find volunteers for real world tests, thought I can think of a few that I'd like to see volunteer. Great post.

[garyb]

Not a whole lot different than the sister load...Win Ranger T 165gr. Good SD Ammo. Very inexpensive. Low recoil. Sharp talons at expansion of .875-.927" with massive wound channels beginning about 1/2" with a 2 1/2 to 3" wide cavity. Penetration to about 12-16". Developed in 1991 as the Black Talon. Replaced by the bonded PDX1. Google the test videos. Plug in Winchester Ranger T video test....or PDX1 video test.

[hotpig]

Ranger T-Series has not been replaced. The Ranger Bonded ie PDX1 is just another product option. Options are always a good thing.

[garyb]

Ranger T-Series has not been replaced. The Ranger Bonded ie PDX1 is just another product option. Options are always a good thing.

I agree....good to have options. However, if you go to Winchester's site you will note that the Ranger T series can not be found anymore. I may be wrong but I believe the Ranger T is not in production and the PDX1 replaces it as a bonded version. I do believe you can still find Ranger T's on the market, but as far as production goes, I don't think so.


However, if I am wrong that will be a good thing. Please show me where the Ranger T's are still be produced....I don't believe they are. Much appreciated. Hope I am wrong.

[hotpig]

I have been a Ranger Dealer since 1998. I still place orders for their T-Series and they fill them. You can find it on their LE web site below. It does not show on their regular commercial web site.




http://winchesterle.com/Products/han...s/default.aspx

[garyb]

Wonder why they don't show them on their web site? Anyway, that is good news. I like the Ranger T's and I have about 100 of them just for carry. I'd guess I won't need to buy anymore carry ammo. If I had to change to PDX1, or Fed Hydrashocks, or Corbons....I'd be fine with that too. The Ranger T's were very inexpensive for the volume of ammo I purchased. Good stuff out there for the 40. Thanks for clarifying that Win still makes the Ranger T. Good news.

[southern thunder]

Good information.

[Barth]

When it comes to defensive handgun ammo.
The not so well kept secret is to buy 50 round boxs LE only stuff.
LE only is just a manufacturer thingy and regular folks can buy and own them.

Thing is a 20/25 round box of Winchester PDX1 or Speer GDHP.
Generally costs about the same as a 50 round box of Winchester Ranger Bonded or Speer Duty GDHP.

I personally favor Federal HST, Winchester Ranger T-Series and Speer Duty GDHP.

Also, in the larger calibers, 357 Sig, 40 S&W and especially .45 ACP,
even the old technology HPs will definitely get the job done.

IMHO - barrier penetration, expansion at lower velocities and low flash gunpowder have been the real advances in performance.

[garyb]

When it comes to defensive handgun ammo.
The not so well kept secret is to buy 50 round boxs LE only stuff.
LE only is just a manufacturer thingy and regular folks can buy and own them.

Thing is a 20/25 round box of Winchester PDX1 or Speer GDHP.
Generally costs about the same as a 50 round box of Winchester Ranger Bonded or Speer Duty GDHP.

I personally favor Federal HST, Winchester Ranger T-Series and Speer Duty GDHP.

Also, in the larger calibers, 357 Sig, 40 S&W and especially .45 ACP,
even the old technology HPs will definitely get the job done.

IMHO - barrier penetration, expansion at lower velocities and low flash gunpowder have been the real advances in performance.

I agree with you completely Barth. That's exactly how I felt about the Ranger T's when I priced them in 50 compared to the PDX1 or similar 25 rd boxes. For some reason, some folks feel that buying boxes of 25 at a higher price equates to better SD ammo. Not so.


That's exactly how I feel about the barrier pen, expansion, lower flash advantages of Ranger T's. But, that said...there are a number of good SD ammo brands out there to pick from. I don't do a ton of shooting with my SD ammo and only use it for carry, so I would not in any way bad mouth any of the other very good 40 cal SD ammo on the market. Lots of good 40 cal SD stuff out there. Can't go wrong IMO. My two 50 rd boxes of Ranger T will probably last me a lifetime. God willing, I pray I never need to shoot a single round for SD....and I can go on in my life by carrying and shooting for fun, sport and hunting.

[chrish]

I think about the best $ per round econo (and a darn good round IMO) is the Critical Duty if you buy from SGAmmo. They have been running (9mm) both the standard and +P for ~$270 for a 500 round case for quite awhile now and they keep getting them back in stock. At around .60/round shipped, that's not bad for a SD round. Pretty much anything decent and retail, even at Walmart, is going to run you $1/round or more.


Last year around this time, they (SG) ran a special at something like $230 if memory serves for 500 rounds. Wish they'd do that again, but even so it's a pretty good price. For the time and effort it takes me to procure cheap WWB at Walmart on the rare occasion they have it in, I can almost just blow this CD downrange.

[Barth]

I think about the best $ per round econo (and a darn good round IMO) is the Critical Duty if you buy from SGAmmo. They have been running (9mm) both the standard and +P for ~$270 for a 500 round case for quite awhile now and they keep getting them back in stock. At around .60/round shipped, that's not bad for a SD round. Pretty much anything decent and retail, even at Walmart, is going to run you $1/round or more.


Last year around this time, they (SG) ran a special at something like $230 if memory serves for 500 rounds. Wish they'd do that again, but even so it's a pretty good price. For the time and effort it takes me to procure cheap WWB at Walmart on the rare occasion they have it in, I can almost just blow this CD downrange.

I've bought Federal and Remington JHPs from SGAmmo at prices nearly the same, and sometimes less than, some FMJs.
I use them for high quality target ammo.
But could absolutely use them for Self Defense in a pinch.