K9 Malfunction

[jocko]

u stated

jocko, only 1 part was removed; the recoil spring. It works the same with the recoil spring in as it does with it out. Taking it out just makes moving the slide easier.

I don't think you got the point of what I was doing. Never intended to shoot the pistol with the recoil spring removed. I simply determined at what point of slide travel the sear engaged the striker.

recoil spring and guide, that is two parts, to me an invalid test. Gun wasn ot designed to produce what ur tried to do when fully assembled.

If u feel comnfortable with that test, fineby me, I just don't think most here will agree with your test of partial disassembly to prove some kind of a point..

[jocko]

glocks

Heres an article about the ability of a Glock to fire OOB: http://www.thegunzone.com/glock/dimples.html

There are a lot of subtleties or variables that come into play when an OOB happens. It's a documented fact that some primers are more easily detonated than others. Some folks here may have experienced that exciting event at their reloading bench.

A partially compressed striker is capable of detonating a sensitive primer while it will not detonate a primer with a thicker cup.

ain't kahrs, kahrs ain't glocks. Why compare them. they are totall different prestaged strikers. If u take the slide off the gun and pull back the striker and it willc lick into place, That is the stage that guni s sitting in at full rest. (no trigger pull). now push in on that striker block. there is not enough spring pressure there to do jack sh!t. Soft primer or not. Just not gonna happen.I try not to prejudge these primer companies. does on think they are gonna put out a primer t6hat isnot safe??? Take 10 different primer makers and one is gonna be a #1 for softness and one is gonna be #10 for hardness. Neithger IMO mean jack sh!t as far as safety goes. #1 IMO is not gonna be a touchy primer or unsafe. Thse ammo companies I amsurethis is not their first rodeo. We tend to say so andso primers are soft compared to so and so. I haveyet to ever see a full test of somesort as to how one determines that. Might be one out there but I have not seen it

[mtnwinds]

jocko, my little experiment certainly is NOT definitive....it's anecdotal; that's all it is. My post wasn't intended to be entered into a popularity contest. I enjoy looking for new information regardless of whose toes get stepped on, including my own.


While my K40 is the first Kahr product I've owned, I have owned, repaired, and manufactured many different types of firearms. I do own, or have owned, products from almost all the various firearms vendors.

So far as waiting for a definitive statement from Kahr, any manufacturer who decides to publicly declare that a firearm accident was their responsibility, in any sense of the word, is going to make a lot of lawyers rich and insure their own demise. Kahr Mfg. is a reputable company that produces some of the best firearms in the world but I can guarantee you that they certainly aren't suicidal.

By their nature, firearms are going to fail and therefore I try to keep myself informed of potential failure points and do what I can to mitigate them.

[plateshooter]

I have an E9 that had a case blow out in the same spot as the OP picture. I was lucky that it just blew the extractor and spring out, broke the back off of a follower and no other damage. I replaced the extractor and spring train and have had no further problems. BTW, my E9 will release the striker with the slide not fully forward as will my CM9.

My E9 was made in 1998 and I am going to order a new recoil spring for it. I am guessing in my instance, a tired spring possibly did not force the slide to go fully forward on a slightly oversize round and that "may" have been the issue. Anyway, recoil springs are cheap so I am going to replace it.

[Kinetic]

Kahr received my K9 today. I took a risk and included two sample Remington UMC rounds for them to inspect and test fire. I also emailed Remington the pictures and an incident report. I'll contact CTL when the weapon returns. I left the broken grips on the K9 so Kahr could investigate by assessing the damage.

I'll update you all within the next few weeks.

[jocko]

u did all u can do, now it is in the hands of the "gift" gods to help u out. I just bet they will all step up to te palte in some fashion.

[Big Bore Lover]

Kahr received my K9 today. I took a risk and included two sample Remington UMC rounds for them to inspect and test fire. I also emailed Remington the pictures and an incident report. I'll contact CTL when the weapon returns. I left the broken grips on the K9 so Kahr could investigate by assessing the damage.

I'll update you all within the next few weeks.

Have you heard anything from Kahr on your pistol? I'm watching this thread as I had a similar thing happen with my PM9. Not as much damage as yours looks to have. Mine simply blew out the extractor and the associated part. Mine was received at Kahr on 12/3/13 so I am just waiting to hear from them what they have to say. Mine was with Speer Gold dot 124 grain ammo. We didn't even find the blown case so have no idea if it was an OOB or a blown primer. I didn't find any damage to the barrel or the magazine. At least from what I was able to see.

Keep us posted on what happens and what Kahr says and does.

[Kinetic]

Have you heard anything from Kahr on your pistol? I'm watching this thread as I had a similar thing happen with my PM9. Not as much damage as yours looks to have. Mine simply blew out the extractor and the associated part. Mine was received at Kahr on 12/3/13 so I am just waiting to hear from them what they have to say. Mine was with Speer Gold dot 124 grain ammo. We didn't even find the blown case so have no idea if it was an OOB or a blown primer. I didn't find any damage to the barrel or the magazine. At least from what I was able to see.

Keep us posted on what happens and what Kahr says and does.

I emailed Kahr for an update today. Hopefully I'll get a detailed response tomorrow. Remington has already sent me a pre-paid shipping label so that I can return the ammo for testing. However, I have several hundred remaining rounds of UMC that wasn't easy to acquire. So I'd rather just send them the faulty casing and the remaining rounds from that particular box of 50. I'll keep everyone posted.

[Kinetic]

I finally called Kahr today after not receiving any email reply...spoke to the gunsmith Jason, who just looked at my K9 yesterday. He quoted $425 for the repair/labor with a new magazine and grips. He blames the damage on a bad round. I asked him if he(Kahr) would go on record when I contact Remington again, and he said Yes.

It cost me $90 to ship my weapon to Kahr and now I'm wondering how to proceed with this. I'll contact Remington after the holiday, but I have a feeling they're going to give me the run-around. Has an ammo manufacturer ever covered repair costs or reimbursed a customer in a situation like this?

[Planedude]

... Has an ammo manufacturer ever covered repair costs or reimbursed a customer in a situation like this?

Yes they have, never for me personally, but do know two people who did receive checks for their troubles. Good luck and keep us updated.

[kerby9mm]

Sorry for your troubles. After reading the posts it seems nobody is going to take responsibility. Guns malfunction & ammo malfunctions. If the gun malfunctioned & did discharge out of battery IMO Kahr won't admit it. Replacing the gun or repairing it would be an admission. Did Toyota ever admit sudden acceleration in their cars? If any of my guns blow up I guess I'm stuck because your cost of repair IMO is not worth it.

[Flieger]

Would it not be proof appropriate for Kahr to detremine fault on behalf of Remington, but in the nature of "Good Will", replace or repair the firearm at no cost to the OP?
By repairing/replacing and stating clearly that the fault was with Remington and not with Kahr, nullify any perceived responsiblity on the part of Kahr.

This forum represents what we like to call "Word of mouth advertising", and quite frankly, it's a bit disturbing to have Kahr dismiss the OP's obvious problem.

I would guess the OP would be willing to sign any document absolving Kahr of any responsibility to get his gun back in righteous order.

Good Customer Service is what makes a company's reputation grow and the sales that go along with them.

But of course, this is just my humble opinion.

[Flieger]

After I left the forum, I did a quick search on "KaBooms" and can you believe what I pulled up?

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=397863

This is the reason I have 2 Kahrs and intend to buy more, because their product and service are supposed to be second to none.

I'd like to know if something has changed to Kahr's service since 2010.

I guess this K9 is a dog. Yeh, I know I'm not the first one to come up with that.

[Kinetic]

After I left the forum, I did a quick search on "KaBooms" and can you believe what I pulled up?

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=397863

This is the reason I have 2 Kahrs and intend to buy more, because their product and service are supposed to be second to none.

I'd like to know if something has changed to Kahr's service since 2010.

I guess this K9 is a dog. Yeh, I know I'm not the first one to come up with that.

Yes, interesting posting...thanks for finding that and sharing. If a bad round is the cause of my KaBoom, then the evidence is still lodged in my K9's chamber. Perhaps that's why Kahr has given me the cold shoulder on this mishap...it's not their mess or responsibility. That's business I suppose.

I reposted the pics for better clarity.
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-D...o/IMG_0221.JPG
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-j...o/IMG_0222.JPG
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-t...o/IMG_0224.JPG
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-7...o/IMG_0228.JPG
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-j...o/IMG_0233.JPG

[Flieger]

Kinetic,
That is not good business.

I was going to send you a private message, but you have a block on your account, so here's what I suggest.

I might pass along the thread I found you to Kahr's customer service and ask them what makes your situation different. In fact, if you read it, the forum OP states that the ammo used was not a brand name and could be interpreted as re-loads.

I could also say by looking at your pictures that the bullet was not fully seated. Regardless, we are not talking about Winchester Ranger +P+ that you used, but basic Remington practice range ammo.

I believe that if Kahr is manufactured on superior CNC equipment, and if you look at one of their most recent catalogs, the first page is devoted to touting how much quality goes into their merchandise, then customer service would walk the talk. They devote an entire paragraph to their slide stop alone.

I have a handgun collection of over 30 currently, 4 of them coming from Magnum Research (I own 2 Baby Eagles) and if this is a true example of how they treat a customer, I want to put some additional thought to the 2 new "K" series handguns I am planning on buying next week.

I own a lot of Sig Sauer products because I have never once been disappointed in their service, and it's no wonder why they have eclipsed so many others.

So please keep us informed as to your progress with Kahr. You know, I came across a "KaBoom" thread on a forum concerning a Kel-tec and the company replaced and even upgraded a few minor things for their customer. I'm talking Kel-tec!

I am going to assume that Kahr considers itself to be a step above Kel-tec.