Kahr Quality going downhill ?

[jg rider]

Hello all,
As I've written many times, my wife and I have 4 Kahrs, 2 K9 Elites from the 1998 era and 2 PM9 from the early 2 thousand. Version 1 and version 2. We cc carry any 2 of these pieces just about daily. In the many, many thousand of rnds. fired thru them they've never failed and the barrels look pristine, even after shooting lead thru them.

Now here's the problem: My son has 2 newer version PM9s. He comes up to our place just about every Sunday and practices with either one of them, along with us and our Kahrs. We noticed the both his barrel chambers are peeling. It's not crud but real chrome peeling. He's shooting the same loads as we use and our barrels are perfect.

So he called Kahr service and got a bunch of run arounds. e.g. "Well since it's happening to both of your barrels it's normal." "When was the last time you changed your recoil springs ?" "Send in the complete pistols, not just the barrels and we'll take a look at them"

No examples about our pistols not having any issues with many more rnds. thru them, then his, or shooting the same loads would change the techs mind about this must be normal.
My son is as gun savvy as I am and the weak excuses offered by the Kahr tech doesn't fly.
Is anyone out there also having issues with their barrels or piss poor customer service excuses. I won't be recommending Kahrs to anyone anymore.

[CJB]

1. Its not chrome its nickel
2. There was a problem some years ago, bad nickel plate
3. Coule be a recurrance.... no wide reports of it right now
4. His CLEANING practices may be part of the problem. Any solvent carrying ammoina compounds (many of them) will seep through the pores in the nickel, and degrade the copper bonding layer. Once that starts to go south, the nickel will begin to peel. Its customary to dry a nickel plated surface, when using things like... Hoppes, Shooter's Choice, Marksman's Choice, Outers, etc etc etc.

Its not the end of the world. The pistols will function fine, and the nickel is for the outside, not the inside of the barrel.... but... Kahr should make it right.

[qmdv]

Just got my PM9 today. Put 50 through it and love it. But is has no chrome to peel.

Tim

[jg rider]

1. Its not chrome its nickel
2. There was a problem some years ago, bad nickel plate
3. Coule be a recurrance.... no wide reports of it right now
4. His CLEANING practices may be part of the problem. Any solvent carrying ammoina compounds (many of them) will seep through the pores in the nickel, and degrade the copper bonding layer. Once that starts to go south, the nickel will begin to peel. Its customary to dry a nickel plated surface, when using things like... Hoppes, Shooter's Choice, Marksman's Choice, Outers, etc etc etc.

Its not the end of the world. The pistols will function fine, and the nickel is for the outside, not the inside of the barrel.... but... Kahr should make it right.

The peeling is in the chamber

[CJB]

You already mentioned that. Was there some further point to be made?

[Bobshouse]

Call Kahr. If you get the idiot at the desk who tells you every part you need is restricted, we need the entire gun, your gonna have to special order that, or any other idiotic answer ask to speak to his supervisor. You will probably have to leave a message, but leave your number and he will call back and take care of all your needs.

I think the guy who works the service desk is paid to block instead of help.

[muggsy]

I think the guy who works the service desk is paid to block instead of help.

I seriously doubt that Justin Moon would support that premise, but he should be made aware of how his employees are responding to his customers.

[CJB]

Maybe they consider plating in the chamber a bit of a wear item? I mean... there's plating in the bore too, at least when its new. I'm sure that goes away pretty quickly with firing.

My older (and now stolen) PM9j had the nickel coming off on the feed ramp. I really can't say it bothered anything as far as function goes. I suspect in the chamber is the same way.

From the Kahr Warranty:

THIS WARRANTY DOES NOT APPLY TO NORMAL WEAR OF ANY PARTS, INCLUDING METAL, WOOD, PLASTIC, RUBBER AND OTHER MATERIAL’S SURFACE FINISH

Maybe they consider that "surface finish"?

[Scarywoody]

Maybe if you took some pictures it would be helpful here. I'm certainly curious. I know that Kahr is in the process of moving their production to Pennsylvania. Right now they are out of Massachusetts and Minnesota. Maybe they have some disgruntled employees that just don't care. I've never encountered a peeling issue in any of my guns, including my sons Taurus and Hi Point POS pistols.

[jg rider]

Maybe they consider plating in the chamber a bit of a wear item? I mean... there's plating in the bore too, at least when its new. I'm sure that goes away pretty quickly with firing.

My older (and now stolen) PM9j had the nickel coming off on the feed ramp. I really can't say it bothered anything as far as function goes. I suspect in the chamber is the same way.

From the Kahr Warranty:

THIS WARRANTY DOES NOT APPLY TO NORMAL WEAR OF ANY PARTS, INCLUDING METAL, WOOD, PLASTIC, RUBBER AND OTHER MATERIAL’S SURFACE FINISH

Maybe they consider that "surface finish"?

I can see two issues occurring
As the peeling increases in the chamber there can be extraction problems
If the peeling moves in to the polygonal rifling it could possibly act as obstructions causing excessive pressures.

With my wife's and mine 4 older Kahrs there hasn't been any indications of peeling. We shoot 100 rnds. each, usually 3x a week of my 124grn. cast lead bullets with a jacketed last round in every other mag. I don't clean them very often, but when I do I use a combination of a lead removing solvent and aggressive Lewis lead remover patches.
My opinion is that the last great customer service was when there was someone named Stephon (sp.) running the repair dept and Randy. and a very nice lady who's name I've forgotten and who's been retired was running the customer service calls.

Does anyone remember her name ?

As far as plating going away, IMHO this shouldn't be. Why bother applying it. Colt would have had big problems with their chrome lined barrels in their M16s & AR15s in the later part of the Nam. war, and in their commercial versions. I don't know which is harder nickle or chrome.

I found this thread

http://www.kahrtalk.com/showthread.p...chamber-on-PM9


.

[CJB]

Lemme getcha a longer shovel. You are diggin quite deep with those two scenarios!



The only issue is the irreparable damage to the psyche.


The nickel is there primarily as a way to prevent galling between the barrel and slide, and in a secondary degree for the prevention of corrosion (more like a bonus feature).

It is not there to ease extraction. Its presence in the bore, and chamber, are due to the fact that the entire barrel is plated. The plating adds insignificant functional physical dimension. Its longevity in the bore is certainly not lengthy, but... you usually cant spot that, because its ironed out as it degrades (by the projectile). Nickel while possessing a natural lubricity, is also fairly soft (hence its ease of being polished).

Grab a small felt wheel, stick it on your Dremel with some Tripoli compound, and your "issues" will be mitigated or eliminated.

I agree it looks nasty, but its looks, not function.

[jg rider]

Lemme getcha a longer shovel. You are diggin quite deep with those two scenarios!



The only issue is the irreparable damage to the psyche.

I'm just stating the facts. If this disturbs you so be it.

[Longitude Zero]

If the weapon functions normally WHAT IS THE ISSUE? As previously posted wear and tear are not covered. Just because it looks ugly does not make Kahr responsible to make anything right as NOTHING is wrong.

[jg rider]

If the weapon functions normally WHAT IS THE ISSUE? As previously posted wear and tear are not covered. Just because it looks ugly does not make Kahr responsible to make anything right as NOTHING is wrong.

As a competitive shooter and retired pistol smith, I suppose I have higher standards then others that are much less experienced with firearms.

End of discussion

[CJB]

It's not crud but real chrome peeling

CJB, take your meds man. we're all long time members in this conversation and no need to go for the throat.