New Member - PM45 failure to feed

[astrorat]

Hi folks

I am a new member and have been lurking for a short while. A few months back I purchased a PM9 and have really enjoyed it and it has performed perfectly. When I saw the PM45, I knew I had to get one as I like the caliber in such a compact size.

My experience with the PM45 has been less positive. First, on the good side, I really like the pistol, it is comfortable, recoil is surprisingly light for such a small frame, and it is very accurate (more accurate than me! LOL!).

I have now shot about 500-600 rounds through it. During the break-in period it would occasionally fail to feed a round and occasionally fail to eject ("stovepipe") a spent case. Over the last 100-150 rounds, it has been failing to feed a round once every 5-10 rounds (1-2 magazines).

The failure will manifest as the slide going back an locking as if the magazine was empty, but there would be one or more rounds remaining in the magazine.

The other way the failure to feed would appear is with a live round jammed at an angle as if it were going up the feed ramp.

As you might imagine, this is very frustrating as when the pistol works...it's just grand!

I have sent Kahr service an email asking for their help.

Has anybody else had a similar experience and if so, any suggestions for a solution?

Thanks in advance for any help!

Lane

[mr surveyor]

it certainly sounds like magazine problems to me. It is a slight possibility that the magazine spring is 180 degrees reversed. This can cause the follower to tip down in the front resulting in a lot of grief. You might check the orientation of the spring in the magazine....at to top, the highest point of the spring should be towards the front of the follower. If that's not the problem, try to pick up or borrow another magazine and give it a try, before you get to intent upon sending the pistol back to the mothership. You may already know that "most" semi auto pistol problems can be traced to magazine glitches.

just my initial guess


surv

[madwill]

sounds like a weak recoil/ slide stop spring. send it back to kahr with a detailed explanation. that's what i did with mine. .

[Price]

Havent had the same specific problem but have had stellar service from Kahr, no matter the issue Im sure it will be solved quickly.

[astrorat]

Thanks for the ideas on where to start.

The failures have occurred with the two magazines that came with the PM45. I have a couple of new magazine that I can try.

Last week I ordered a replacement spring set from Kahr as a "just in case" for the future. I'll see what Kahr has to say about the possibility of a weak recoil spring.

Thanks, again.

Lane

[astrorat]

I disassembled one of the magazines I was using during the failures to feed and the spring was inserted correctly. There does seem to be a bit of play at the front of the follower. When the rounds are inserted, the round at the top has some movement at the tip (bullet) at the front of the follower.

I recall seeing a video about similar movement with the PM9 magazines (which I have with my PM9, but I have not had any feed failures).

Lane

[Tackleberry]

Failure to Feed?

On your failure to feed problem, have you tried different brands/loads? I also have a PM9 which runs perfectly. Don't own a PM45 but do own 3 other .45 ACP's, 2 1911's and 1 XD and despite the reputation, many .45 are sensitive to different loads. I'd experiment with lighter and heavier bullet weights in whatever JHP you plan to carry. Find the grain that functions 100%, then test 3 or 4 brands to find the one that groups the best at point of aim.

On the locking open w/ammo still in the mag, pay close attention that your weak thumb is not engaging the slide stop during recoil. It's easy to do with Kahrs because the slide stops are quite large and easier to do without noticing your doing it.

[jocko]

the slide lockingopen prematurely canonly be caused by a couple of things.

#1. Your thumb is accidently hitting the slide lock lever while shooting. try shooting it left handed to see if that still persists.

#2. Your rounds are hittinginside on the slide lock lever causing slide lock. Easy to check to. take slide off, reinsert slide lock lever and insert a loaded magazine. See if that top rounds wnats to move that slide lock lever upward any. It shoud not toucht he slide lock lever at all. This will also cause FTF to. If this is happening callkahr and hav ethem send you a new slide lock lever.

Process of elimination.

[getsome]

Hi astrorat, Welcome to Kahrtalk....Lots of good folks and info here... So far all replies could be part of the problem...If you can find a copy of the latest Combat Handguns magazine, they do a test on both the p380 and the pm45...The p380 never missed a beat but the pm45 started having the same issues as you describe....The writer found that the more he shot the worse the problem of FTF became...He had someone else shoot it and no more problems....The issue seemed to be hand fatigue from recoil...He also found that due to having large hands and shooting such a small gun that during recoil his little finger was pushing down on the magazine baseplate causing most of the FTF problems....perhaps a flat baseplate with no finger rest might work better on the higher caliber pistols or experiment with different grips or try shooting gloves...You really have to have a tight grip and a locked wrist to give that short slide something to push against to get that big ol .45 round to chamber....If all else fails, send her back to Kahr and they will make it right for you....One last thing...the deal you describe with the top round tip wanting to move down is normal and how they designed the magazine to work....Try this trick others have found to help....Load up a full magazine and give the back side a good whack to seat the rounds all the way back and be sure that top round is pushed all the way back and pointed up as it should be...hope this helps....Good luck with it....

[astrorat]

Thanks for the welcome and all the great suggestions...now I just need to get back out to the range to try them. I'll need to take a checklist!

I'll keep an eye out for the right thumb hitting the slide lock lever. As mentioned, I have not noticed this, but will shoot it left-handed to see if there is a FTF.

I'll look at the feeding withe slide lock lever.

I had thought of the little finger pressing on the finger rest of the magazine. I tried firing with the little finger not on the rest, but got a FTF. That may have been due to a weak grip, however.

I don't think hand fatigue was the issue as the FTF was occurring after shooting about 10 rounds. Now, it may have been a weak grip, but I don't recall that specifically.

I have tried different brands of ammo, but mostly have been shooting Winchester 230 gr FMJ (white box) and some Remington UMC (from Walmart). The FTF has happened with both. Although I have not put many of the Hydra-Shok (230 gr, if I recall), they did not have any FTF.

Yep...it's a process of elimination. I just need to learn much more about the mechanics of the pistol so I can use the logic that comes so easily to you seasoned shooters.

Thanks again...this is a great education.

Lane

[getsome]

Your very welcome....Listen to old jocko as he is very knowledgeable and will give you the straight stuff....A couple things I thought of after my post is that Wolfe has a higher rated recoil spring available you could try, I think it's a 22 lb rate if I remember correctly...Also the PM45 seems to function better with higher power loads and sometimes will act up with target ammo...Gold Dot 230 grain is a good one for carry.... Pay attention to the lube chart in the Kahrtech forum and be sure you hit all the spots shown...DO NOT put any oil in the striker/firing pin hole....These guns seem to run better a little wet until really broken in....Last thing is when you clean it next put a good polish job on that feed ramp with some metal polish like flitz and make it as smooth as possible...may not help but cant hurt anything.....

[astrorat]

I got a message this morning from Kahr service. They recommend sending the pistol to them for evaluation. I hope this is covered under warranty!

Lane

[astrorat]

Thanks, getsome. I found the lube chart and followed it faithfully for the last cleaning. Great info!

While I am waiting to hear from Kahr, I'll look into the Wolfe spring and how to polish the feed ramp.

Lane

[getsome]

Yes any problems will be covered by Kahr...If you call them at 508-795-3919 and ask to speak to Ian, tell him about the problems and if you ask real nice they will send you a pre-paid fedex package so you dont have to pay to ship it....As for the feed ramp polish...some have used a dremel tool and a soft polishing bit to do it but I don't have a dremel so I first took some 1200 grit super fine wet/dry sand paper and gently polished it by hand, then followed up with a soft cloth and metal polish...looks like a mirror now....You don't want to remove any metal just slick and shine it up....

[astrorat]

Thanks. The email I received from Kahr service was from Ian. Perhaps I should call him then to ask about a pre-paid FedEx box.

I appreciate the suggestion.

Lane