My wife gave me my first Kahr today & have some questions I need help with

[TheManInTally]

Merry Christmas Everyone!

First Post on the Forum :-)

I have been lurking around here for a couple of months and registered today after my wife gave me my Christmas Present. I got a Kahr PM9 with night sights, LCI & Safety (Safety wasn't my choice (especially since I am a lefty) but she felt better about getting it just in case she or I wanted to use it.)

I read the owners manual thoroughly and re read several parts of it.
After that, I racked the slide and worked with it for probably 30 to 50 slide pulls to get a feel for it. My hands looked like I had been playing in a craft store glitter aisle with all the silver glints of metal from it so after getting comfortable with it I decided it was time to strip it, inspect it, clean it and oil it.

I a so glad I have been reading the forum and already knew it would be a bear to get the pin out. It was but I was ready and used the nylon handle of a screw driver. I also used a fiberglass mini pry tool used to open automotive dashes, door panels, etc. to pull out the pin a little more because it is tight even after relieving the the pressure with the slide. I also did not expect that much tension on the spring (even though I had read when new it could be under a lot of force but I was able to remove it without damage to it or myself/property.

Upon inspection of the grip housing is were my first questions come in. Since I am new here I am not sure of my photo posting rights and haven't really looked into the bandwidth etiquette of the forum (My Walther forum is a bandwidth Nazi) So I hope it is OK to include embedded pic from photobucket...






Please review the photos and here are the questions I have:

1. When looking at the left side of the grip housing there is a VERY clear bulge, disproportionate symmetry, etc on the left side vs. the right on both the polymer of the housing and the amount of metal of the slide rails. The picture doesn't do any justice to this but when I was trying to show my wife something else she immediately asked me "why is that bulged out right there?"
2. There is MUCH more exposed metal on the left rail than the right rail. Is this normal?
3. The left rail has a "witness mark"/missing material about a half of an inch from the top that can be seen in the picture. Is this normal?
4. You can see some of the polymer burring at the very top left of the polymer grip and if you look closely, at the bottom of the right rail about 1/2 inch up. Of course I can remove the left side easily but I want to let you know that the right side had a big "glob" of polymer where you see the burring that I removed with my fingernail. Are these type of production issues normal? Should I sand down (lightly of course) the rough plastic that is now left on the right? The "glob" was not due to manufacturing in itself. It was clearly created due to friction between the moving parts. I should have kept it and took a picture but did not. It the same type of glob you would get when using a dremel or drill on plastic.
5. There is alot of tooling/stamping AND wear marks & irregularities happening already on the metal rails that you can see in the photos and I can see and feel greater in person. Should I sand/polish this away?

Finally,
My last question. When I was reviewing the manual thoroughly I also read the warranty on the back of it. I had seen that Kahrs used to have a lifetime warranty to the original owner when I was researching CCW guns but had also seen online and on the forum that the warranty for the new ones is only for 5 years. Also, the Kahr website says 5 years. HOWEVER.....My Manual that is copyrighted 2016 clearly states on the back cover warranty that "Kahr arms agrees to correct for five years any defect in the Kahr Value Series to the original purchaser" in the second paragraph.
The third paragraph though states " Kahr arms agrees to correct for the LIFETIME any defect in the Kahr Premium Series or the Kahr Gen2 Premium Series to the original purchaser"

So which is it? The PM9is clearly listed as premium series (Even on the front page of the manual) so I would assume it has a lifetime warranty. What are your thoughts on this?

Thank You In Advance For Your Help!
Michael in Tallahassee,FL

[Bawanna]

The buldge you mention is normal, no concern. The excess pieces of polymer as you say can be carefully trimmed with an exacto or sanded.

The witness mark is indeed just that. It's there to correctly orient the metal to the polymer. The rails are actually one continuous piece, not just a little chunk stuck in the frame.

I've not noticed on the warranty, I thought they all had gone to 5 years but I got nothing solid to back that up with.

For some reason I'm unable to open your pictures. to see much more exposed metal on the left side. Will have to wait till somebody can see that.

[TheManInTally]

The buldge you mention is normal, no concern. The excess pieces of polymer as you say can be carefully trimmed with an exacto or sanded.

The witness mark is indeed just that. It's there to correctly orient the metal to the polymer. The rails are actually one continuous piece, not just a little chunk stuck in the frame.

I've not noticed on the warranty, I thought they all had gone to 5 years but I got nothing solid to back that up with.

For some reason I'm unable to open your pictures. to see much more exposed metal on the left side. Will have to wait till somebody can see that.

Thank You for the info! here are the Pics another way and I hope this is OK here..

[TheManInTally]

Here is a pic of the warranty on the back of the manual. Second & Third paragraph are the most important..

[Bawanna]

OK, that's speaking directly of the Gen2 premium version which I haven't even seen yet. Not sure they are even out.

Were supposed to be but I think they are behind.

Not sure why they would do that but it's wrote down right there for us to read.

[TheManInTally]

I thought the same thing but I does say Premium Series OR Kahr Gen2. Also, the front of the manual clearly lists The Value and Premium models and pictures and the PM is under the Premium Series section on the cover. very interesting.

[yqtszhj]

The gun looks ok. I'd go shoot it and enjoy it.

I see what you mean about the "premium series" statement. Looks like they may cover "PM" series for the lifetime.

Be at ease though, the few of us that have had problems with our pistols kahr has stepped up and taken care of it. Of my 5 Kahrs i had a frame problem with a CW45 after 1000+ rounds and kahr replaced the frame at no cost. The gun functioned fine but the frame issue was so ething they wanted to resolve and kahr handled it, and that was after 4+ years.

Welcome to the forum.

[dustnchips]

Looks to me like it is the premium AND gen2 premium that have the lifetime coverage. I'd say the gun is fine, but you should go through the items listed on the New Gun Prep sticky. Also go through the Kahr Lube sticky. Then go shoot it and enjoy it. All of the things you have seen on close examination will disappear from your mind once you have shot it.

[TheManInTally]

Thanks everyone for the info. Yes I have already read the info on the forum and will continue the process when I get home. I'm a gun scrubber guy so I am going to use that on everything and then us my Mpro7 cleaner, oil and grease products on it as described in the other thread and then start pre breaking it in. I also plan to break down and clean the 2 6 round mags and the three others she got me from Khar and check those too. I don't plan on training with the extended mag so therefore I won't use it so I'm just going to leave it in the box.

[gb6491]

Merry Christmas Everyone!

First Post on the Forum :-)

I have been lurking around here for a couple of months and registered today after my wife gave me my Christmas Present. I got a Kahr PM9 with night sights, LCI & Safety (Safety wasn't my choice (especially since I am a lefty) but she felt better about getting it just in case she or I wanted to use it.)

I read the owners manual thoroughly and re read several parts of it.
After that, I racked the slide and worked with it for probably 30 to 50 slide pulls to get a feel for it. My hands looked like I had been playing in a craft store glitter aisle with all the silver glints of metal from it so after getting comfortable with it I decided it was time to strip it, inspect it, clean it and oil it.

I a so glad I have been reading the forum and already knew it would be a bear to get the pin out. It was but I was ready and used the nylon handle of a screw driver. I also used a fiberglass mini pry tool used to open automotive dashes, door panels, etc. to pull out the pin a little more because it is tight even after relieving the the pressure with the slide. I also did not expect that much tension on the spring (even though I had read when new it could be under a lot of force but I was able to remove it without damage to it or myself/property.

Upon inspection of the grip housing is were my first questions come in. Since I am new here I am not sure of my photo posting rights and haven't really looked into the bandwidth etiquette of the forum (My Walther forum is a bandwidth Nazi) So I hope it is OK to include embedded pic from photobucket...




Please review the photos and here are the questions I have:

1. When looking at the left side of the grip housing there is a VERY clear bulge, disproportionate symmetry, etc on the left side vs. the right on both the polymer of the housing and the amount of metal of the slide rails. The picture doesn't do any justice to this but when I was trying to show my wife something else she immediately asked me "why is that bulged out right there?"
2. There is MUCH more exposed metal on the left rail than the right rail. Is this normal?
3. The left rail has a "witness mark"/missing material about a half of an inch from the top that can be seen in the picture. Is this normal?
4. You can see some of the polymer burring at the very top left of the polymer grip and if you look closely, at the bottom of the right rail about 1/2 inch up. Of course I can remove the left side easily but I want to let you know that the right side had a big "glob" of polymer where you see the burring that I removed with my fingernail. Are these type of production issues normal? Should I sand down (lightly of course) the rough plastic that is now left on the right? The "glob" was not due to manufacturing in itself. It was clearly created due to friction between the moving parts. I should have kept it and took a picture but did not. It the same type of glob you would get when using a dremel or drill on plastic.
5. There is alot of tooling/stamping AND wear marks & irregularities happening already on the metal rails that you can see in the photos and I can see and feel greater in person. Should I sand/polish this away?

Finally,
My last question. When I was reviewing the manual thoroughly I also read the warranty on the back of it. I had seen that Kahrs used to have a lifetime warranty to the original owner when I was researching CCW guns but had also seen online and on the forum that the warranty for the new ones is only for 5 years. Also, the Kahr website says 5 years. HOWEVER.....My Manual that is copyrighted 2016 clearly states on the back cover warranty that "Kahr arms agrees to correct for five years any defect in the Kahr Value Series to the original purchaser" in the second paragraph.
The third paragraph though states " Kahr arms agrees to correct for the LIFETIME any defect in the Kahr Premium Series or the Kahr Gen2 Premium Series to the original purchaser"

So which is it? The PM9is clearly listed as premium series (Even on the front page of the manual) so I would assume it has a lifetime warranty. What are your thoughts on this?

Thank You In Advance For Your Help!
Michael in Tallahassee,FL

Welcome to the forums

To address your concerns:
1. As folks have stated, there is a "bulging" of the frame's dust cover on Kahr poly pistols that is considered "normal". With the slide in place, the bulge is slightly asymmetrical on my CW9, CW45 and P380: all have sightly more material to the left.
2. The rails on my poly Kahrs seem about equal to me. That yours don't may or may not be of concern. How much engagement do the rails on your pistol have side to side with the slide?
Here's what my CW9 and CW45 look like with the slide locked back:

It's difficult to show (in a photo) the engagement with the slide forward, but you should be able to see it in person with a flashlight.
3. Bawanna's reply to this was spot on.
4. If you are talking about the polymer in this area:

I'd clean it up. Some care needs to be taken when installing the slide as it's easy to mar the poly if the slide isn't centered when you start to slide it on.
5. I wouldn't mess those rails or I would at least wait until I had several boxes of rounds down range to evaluate if they need any TLC.

As to the warranty, I'd give Kahr a call for the definitive word. I'm of the same mind as Bawanna in thinking they all went to 5 years (FWIW, the Kahr website says this: "Each Kahr pistol is backed by Kahr Arm's Five Year Limited Warranty. We stand by our product." http://www.kahr.com/kahr-customer-service.asp

Regards,
Greg

BTW, congrats on the new PM9!

[TheManInTally]

Welcome to the forums

To address your concerns:
1. As folks have stated, there is a "bulging" of the frame's dust cover on Kahr poly pistols that is considered "normal". With the slide in place, the bulge is slightly asymmetrical on my CW9, CW45 and P380: all have sightly more material to the left.
2. The rails on my poly Kahrs seem about equal to me. That yours don't may or may not be of concern. How much engagement do the rails on your pistol have side to side with the slide?
Here's what my CW9 and CW45 look like with the slide locked back:

It's difficult to show (in a photo) the engagement with the slide forward, but you should be able to see it in person with a flashlight.
3. Bawanna's reply to this was spot on.
4. If you are talking about the polymer in this area:

I'd clean it up. Some care needs to be taken when installing the slide as it's easy to mar the poly if the slide isn't centered when you start to slide it on.
5. I wouldn't mess those rails or I would at least wait until I had several boxes of rounds down range to evaluate if they need any TLC.

As to the warranty, I'd give Kahr a call for the definitive word. I'm of the same mind as Bawanna in thinking they all went to 5 years (FWIW, the Kahr website says this: "Each Kahr pistol is backed by Kahr Arm's Five Year Limited Warranty. We stand by our product." http://www.kahr.com/kahr-customer-service.asp

Regards,
Greg

BTW, congrats on the new PM9!

Greg,

Thank you for your post and information. I finished my initial inspection/clean/lube/grease on the rails of the slide following the Kahr Manual and what I have read here in the pre prep of a new Kahr. Here is what I have discovered.

1. Yes, the chewed up areas on the back of the slide rail of the polymer grip were noticed (the ones you bracketed in red) but I was more concerned with some serious material removal/displacement/replacement that was on the right rail about a half inch up from the top of the red on your bracket. Eitherway, I decided that Khar build it for a reason like they did so I just took a few different Hoppes plastic picks and gently scrapped off and removed anything along the housing that didn't see to be "factory" that would let me do so. I wanted to clean up the bracketed area you showed me but I had no idea what the original geometry of those rails are supposed to look like so I moved on. FWIW. I agree about careful alignment when reassembling the firearm but do understand, this "damage" wasn't done by me. I had never removed the slide until right before the photo was taken and only put the firearm back together tonight.

2. I reviewed your pictures on the metal rails of the slide on your firearm. Here are are mine. I am concerned with the large gap on mine on the right hand side but am even more concerned with the left side having absolutely no gap. I guess that is where all the fine metal glitter all over my hands again tonight is coming from possibly?......(and sorry, I am not as good of a photographer as you are sir.)


3. Kahr & the forum should do a disclaimer that reads "Make absolutely sure that the LCI red paint does not come in contact of liquid, vapor or anything else that is emitted from GunScrubber/Brake Cleaner." I use GunScrubber and while I sure I took steps to keep most of the liquid from sitting on the slide anywhere while I cleaned the striker channel, the vapor or small amount of liquid that did touch the LCI immediately removed every single trace of red paint in the "Indicator" engraving! I then took extra careful precautions to protect the red dot of paint on the safety!

[Bobshouse]

The plastic guides on your kahr are there to assist in reassembly, they are not really needed for proper operation of the firearm. After you shoot it a couple hundred rounds or so, scrape off the shreaded polymer and you probably wont be bothered by it anymore.

Watch that Gunscrubber stuff, it will melt your gun. The gunscrubber sold in California wont, thanks to our chemical regulations here.

[TheManInTally]

Thank you for the info on the poly rails. As for the gun scrubber, I haven't had a problem before on poly and I did spray some and let it sit on the inside of the grip housing between the rails to see if it would do anything and it didn't. I have had it discolor the "bluing" on night sites so I actually taped those with painters tape when I did it last night. I find gun scrubber and brake cleaner to be the same except different brands smell a little different with gun scrubber and autozones brake cleaner smelling about the same.

[Bawanna]

I think they took all the good stuff out of gun scrubber about the same time they did it to brake cleaner.

California no doubt said it was bad for folks so it goes the way of the dinesaw.

Like paint. Take away the lead and you paint often, I think it's a conspiracy myself. Where's my tin foil hat.

[gb6491]

TheManInTally,
I suggest you contact Kahr customer service about your concerns (ask them to review your photos). They may tell you that the rails are functional as they are or they may want you to send it in (the former is my guess).
As to the metal glitter:
1. You could be correct about it coming off the rails
2. It could be debris from test firing (flaked primers or brass)
3. Kahr barrels are nickle plated, perhaps some of that has come off.
4. Anywhere moving metal parts contact each other could be potential causes.

Thanks for heads up on the paint coming off the LCI. That's the first time I've read of it, but I'd also say we don't seem to have much discussion of the LCI here.

Regards,
Greg