Hornady, what's your opinion/support?

[MO_Soldier]

I'm a big Hornady guy. I love their ever-changing ballistics research and production. I feel that I can trust, that Hornady is on the leading edge of advanced scientific research, and if I have their best ammo, I have the best mankind has to offer.

I'm taking opposing and supporting opinions in this thread for 2 things.
1) Pro Hornady and why? OR Why aren't you? (and make these reasons good, because Hornady gives solid evidence as to their reliable penetration, reliability, and overall terminal ballistic performance in ballistic jells with all sorts of barriers in front of them.)

2) For those that are Pro Hornady, they are currently offering 3 types of handgun personal defense ammunition, including a new release.
TAP FPD - http://www.hornady.com/store/9mm-Luger-147-HP-XTP-FPD/
Critical Defense - http://www.hornady.com/store/9mm-Lug...tical-Defense/
and the new Critical Duty - http://www.hornady.com/store/9MM-135...Critical-DUTY/
What are your takes on these different loads? I can't find any research that can tell me the difference between these loads.

[Bill K]

I now winter carry CD in my .380. I tried them when they first became available and had no issues with them fired from my P3AT. After independent tests became available I became convinced that CD would be a particularly good choice for winter .380 carry. For summer carry I believe that there are several HP offerings that will perform better not having to go through heavier winter clothing so that clogging is not likely an issue.

[Thunder71]

Hornady is on the bottom of my list, any ammo company that produces Zombie Defense ammo is a joke in my opinion.

And Critical Defense? As opposed to what? Non critical defense?

Great at marketing for 12 year olds, I'll stick to others for my personal protection.

And yes, I'm serious... at first I thought it was a Halloween prank - but it's real.

[MO_Soldier]

Hornady is on the bottom of my list, any ammo company that produces Zombie Defense ammo is a joke in my opinion.

And Critical Defense? As opposed to what? Non critical defense?

Great at marketing for 12 year olds, I'll stick to others for my personal protection.

And yes, I'm serious... at first I thought it was a Halloween prank - but it's real.

I've seen a lot of your posts Thunder and respect what you say a lot. That's why I was surprised to be laughing at your reply. (Not you, just your reply. It's funny, no disrespect intended.)
I too laughed at their Zombie-killers, but took is less seriously. I'm looking more impartially at terminal ballistic results, and I have yet to come across someone producing a non-expanding Hornady round...through ANY barrier/matter.

[MO_Soldier]

I now winter carry CD in my .380. I tried them when they first became available and had no issues with them fired from my P3AT. After independent tests became available I became convinced that CD would be a particularly good choice for winter .380 carry. For summer carry I believe that there are several HP offerings that will perform better not having to go through heavier winter clothing so that clogging is not likely an issue.

Remember, Hornady's FTX technology provides reliable expansion through barriers as well as thick clothing. I think I'll be carrying it 365. They're really pushing clothing penetration on their CDefense line, whereas they're marketing the Critical Duty line to be more of barrier penetraters from what I can tell.

[Bill K]

Remember, Hornady's FTX technology provides reliable expansion through barriers as well as thick clothing. I think I'll be carrying it 365. They're really pushing clothing penetration on their CDefense line, whereas they're marketing the Critical Duty line to be more of barrier penetraters from what I can tell.

Oops! I see I need to be more careful. Typing CD now can mean CDefense or CDuty. I'm using CDefense in my .380. This post is the first I've learned about CDuty.

[Charlie98]

Say whay you want about the Zombie ammo, get past the silly sophmoric box and look at the ammo within. I'm tired of the Zombie thing, too, but you have to laugh at it. Call it advertising innovation. And, as far as the name (Critical... whatever) they have to keep up with all the other ammo makers and their clever names. (Anyone remember Black Talon? HydroShock? Ranger? Golden Saber? ...the list of melodramatic names goes on.)

I did fire 20 rounds of the TAP 147grn 9mm in my new CW9 yesterday, I put 4 of 5 rounds into one hole at 15'. No big muzzle flash or heavy recoil... it was sweet shooting stuff.

Hornady is probably putting as much R&D into their defense ammo as everyone else is (Speer, Winchester, Federal...) so just pick a name you like or the ammo your pistol likes best. I like heavy bullets, and the poly tip HP's... so I'll probably wind up with the 135grn Flex-Lock Critical Duty.

[MO_Soldier]

Oops! I see I need to be more careful. Typing CD now can mean CDefense or CDuty. I'm using CDefense in my .380. This post is the first I've learned about CDuty.

As far as I know, CDuty has just been released. I carry CDefense in my PM9 right now, it feeds and shoots very well but since I never know the damage the bullet causes, I research heavily into terminal ballistics. The arrival of CDuty gives me the heavier 135gr PLUS a +P option. It peaks my interest because I think it will give me the clothing penetration AND more barrier penetration than the CDefense does. Plus, more mass means more inertia, which translates to for ft/lbs of force! SWEEET

Say whay you want about the Zombie ammo, get past the silly sophmoric box and look at the ammo within. I'm tired of the Zombie thing, too, but you have to laugh at it. Call it advertising innovation. And, as far as the name (Critical... whatever) they have to keep up with all the other ammo makers and their clever names. (Anyone remember Black Talon? HydroShock? Ranger? Golden Saber? ...the list of melodramatic names goes on.)

I did fire 20 rounds of the TAP 147grn 9mm in my new CW9 yesterday, I put 4 of 5 rounds into one hole at 15'. No big muzzle flash or heavy recoil... it was sweet shooting stuff.

Hornady is probably putting as much R&D into their defense ammo as everyone else is (Speer, Winchester, Federal...) so just pick a name you like or the ammo your pistol likes best. I like heavy bullets, and the poly tip HP's... so I'll probably wind up with the 135grn Flex-Lock Critical Duty.

Well said! As for me, the less recoil and muzzle flash the better. But I would give up some recoil for better terminal ballistics. I myself am going to undergo some personal ballistic testing with some of these rounds with water jugs. Apparently it's a cost-effective way of getting similar bullet expansion while stopping your rounds so they're recoverable. This will also give me the opportunity to feel how they shoot too!

[LaP]

Hornady shoots well out of my CW9, M&P 9 compact, and S&W 642.

Will it perform as advertised? I don't know... I've never been in a defensive shooting. Do I load my handguns with it? Yes.

[stumprat]

Hornady is on the bottom of my list, any ammo company that produces Zombie Defense ammo is a joke in my opinion.

And Critical Defense? As opposed to what? Non critical defense?

Great at marketing for 12 year olds, I'll stick to others for my personal protection.

And yes, I'm serious... at first I thought it was a Halloween prank - but it's real.

Sorry, I couldn't resist.

[LaP]

Stumprat:
Couldn't she just outrun her friend? No need for tripping. Manners, manners now.

[Mr. S]

I have used the TAP and TAP-FPD(they both use the XTP bullet) and found both rounds to be very accurate.
The negatives for me.
I don't believe they expand as well as other hollowpints
The cost, specifically only being available in 25 or 20 round boxes round boxes is a deal breaker for me.

Critical Defense well let me say my opinion of them is well known.
I don't like them.
Here are my reasons.
They perform(as advertised) under limited circumstances which is my main issue.If you are going to be in a self defense situation you will not be able to set the circumstances.I feel you are limiting yourself and your chance of survival by using them.
http://www.firearmstactical.com/tact...06/04/main.htm
They are also not available in 50 round boxes so the price is still an issue(I wouldn't use them if they were anyway).

The Critical Duty line looks interesting, almost as if they realize the Critical Defense was not up to standards.The performance looks good.I would like to see some idependent testing done eventually.
I wonder if it will be available in 50 round LE type boxes?
Perhaps it is a step in the right direction.

[Thunder71]

Say whay you want about the Zombie ammo, get past the silly sophmoric box and look at the ammo within.

Why? They clearly state it's for use on real zombies only... friggin' joke and waste of time and money on their part and anyone who looks into that ammo.

Sorry, I just don't put a lot of stake in a company that goes out of its way to come up with something like this, and in the next sentence state how great their new 'Critical XXXX' ammo is.

But it does have neat green filling.

[Knight92]

I would have to agree with the statement in the link you posted Mr. S, If I have to shoot threw a windshield or a trunk then I am probably going to jail. Sure there are some odd circumstances you can never account for, but I am worried about passing through the bad guy and hitting somebody else. Even worse I am worried about shooting and missing and the bullet going through the wall and injuring some innocent.

[Mr. S]

I would have to agree with the statement in the link you posted Mr. S, If I have to shoot threw a windshield or a trunk then I am probably going to jail. Sure there are some odd circumstances you can never account for, but I am worried about passing through the bad guy and hitting somebody else. Even worse I am worried about shooting and missing and the bullet going through the wall and injuring some innocent.

That statement came from someone at Hornady about their Critical Defense ammo.Its ironic they say that when Critical Defense isn't designed to work on barriers.
But now low and behold they have a new "Critical Duty" round available that addresses that concern.

Anyway back to the original topic..Do you have an opinion on Hornday?