Manual Safeties Yes or No?

[jg rider]

I always use a manual safety when pocket carrying



Seriously I found this about a Glock safety

http://www.thegunzone.com/glock/stb.html

I wonder if any one makes one for Kahr?
IMHO, if it aint holstered a thumb safety is ify.
A while back I wrote about knowing someone (LEO) shoot himself through the check of his a$$ and into his calf.
He was carrying a 1911, Mexican style while O.D. in a pair of dress pants. The thumb safety worked it's way off way off and the inside pants buttons for suspenders hooked the trigger.

I know the trigger can't be pushed as easy, but the safety can work it's self off riding loose in a pocket.
I sandwich my PM9 between 2 pieces of a flexible thin back cover of a DVD case, that covers the trigger and carry in my back pocket.

If we start putting safeties on long D.A.O. like trigger pulls on autos. Soon we'll be putting them on revolvers

[jocko]

when I had my sporting good business it was inside one part of ou tire store. I always had gun friends in visiting etc. One day, this one gun fella, whom I considered knowledeable about guns as he must have had a 100+ . anyway he went into the mens restroom to take a dunk and BANG came this noise from the gun room . we all ran to the locked door and there was a 38 spl hole right throgh the top portion of the door. He was taking a dump and playing with his Model 60 and yup, it went bang. the round upwalrd and ended up hittig a ceiling I-beam.

No harm, no foul, BUT HE NEVER CAME BACK INTO MY PLACE AGAIN. He was a person who thought he was rambo and knew everythig about guns and he did know guns to but he didn't know gun safety that was for sure. He could not explain that incident away, so he choose to never come back.

[muggsy]

None of my Kahr pistols has a manual safety. I carry them in holsters that covers the trigger. My Kahr pistols cannot go bang unless I pull the trigger. That's safety enough for me. I always treat every gun as if it were loaded. I never point the gun at anything that I don't intend to destroy. I keep the muzzle pointed in a safe direction. I'm sure of my target and aware of what's beyond. Gun safety is no accident. A gun is only as safe as it's user. Learn it, live it.

[Popeye]

You're right. The grip safety does provide an automatic and effective mechanism for safer handling of XDs.

It's funny. I never hear 1911 owners talk about carrying cocked and unlocked, depending on the grip safety to prevent an AD. Of course, we are talking about a light single action trigger, unlike the XD. But light trigger or not, it's not going to fire unless that grip safety is firmly compressed, right?

Another gun that comes to mind as one with a safety lever that might be pretty safe without it is the Sig P238 because, as I understand it, that single action trigger is at least 7.5 lb. No grip safety, though. Not saying I would want to carry one in my pocket that way, but maybe in a belt holster?

Not saying I would carry any single action gun cocked and unlocked, but just wanted to express some thoughts for discussion.

The grip safety on the XD line of pistols is very easy to compress you hardly notice it's there and your pressing it. I suppose you could accidently fire the gun by holding it in some unnatural position but you'd really have to be having serious brain fart or senior moment. I've also never heard of one malfunctioning.
As far as pocket carry the only ones I can see being carried in a pocket comfortably at least for me are the Ruger LCP and the P3at size pistols. I very rarely carry in a pants pocket but do carry in a vest or jacket pocket quite often.

[Barth]

None of my Kahr pistols has a manual safety. I carry them in holsters that covers the trigger. My Kahr pistols cannot go bang unless I pull the trigger. That's safety enough for me. I always treat every gun as if it were loaded. I never point the gun at anything that I don't intend to destroy. I keep the muzzle pointed in a safe direction. I'm sure of my target and aware of what's beyond. Gun safety is no accident. A gun is only as safe as it's user. Learn it, live it.

+1
I don't think I agree with you much - LOL!
But you're dead on with this one.

[jg rider]

Well I just shamed myself when I saw how I pocket carried my PM9.
After a nice conversation with Sam Andrews, I just ordered a pocket holster from him. I never met or spoke to this gentleman before now.

http://www.andrewsleather.com/pocket.htm#wallet

[O'Dell]

I just saw a similar poll on another non-centric manufacturer gun forum. The results there were 58% to 42% in favor of no safety on a carry gun after 400 or 500 votes. I didn't get clobbered quite so badly on that poll. I wonder if it has to do with the fact that this is a Kahr forum and Kahrs normally don't have manual safeties.

[muggsy]

+1
I don't think I agree with you much - LOL!
But you're dead on with this one.

You must be slippin, Barth.

[muggsy]

I just saw a similar poll on another non-centric manufacturer gun forum. The results there were 58% to 42% in favor of no safety on a carry gun after 400 or 500 votes. I didn't get clobbered quite so badly on that poll. I wonder if it has to do with the fact that this is a Kahr forum and Kahrs normally don't have manual safeties.

That is a distinct possibility O'Dell, but none of my revolvers have safeties, either. My 1911 does, but then it not a striker fire DAO pistol. Safeties have their place and I wouldn't sell a gun because it had one. I just believe that in some instances they are not necessary or desirable. To each his own.

[Kahrdriver64]

Not necessary and potentially dangerous to the user if not trained to deal with it. The decocking safety on my 96F means it will never be a ccw for me. It's a fun range pistol and has its place in a drop leg holster but not for SD. Waaaaay to many things to do between "Oh ****" and Bang.

The lack of a safety and DAO were number 2 on my list of attractions to Kahr right behind how well they fit my hand and finger length.

[HenryinFlorida]

On my 1911, of course I want a manual safety so I can keep it cocked and locked. But, on a DAO pistol the safety isn't necessary. That's why they have a longer and firmer trigger pull. As long as you have it holstered, and use proper procedures to holster and unholster you should be plenty safe.

[jocko]

except glocks!!! or kimber solo

[O'Dell]

But, on a DAO pistol the safety isn't necessary. That's why they have a longer and firmer trigger pull. As long as you have it holstered, and use proper procedures to holster and unholster you should be plenty safe.

Sorry, I still don't agree. If that were true no one would ever have a ND. People are still the weakest link in the shooter - gun equation, and until we can correct that, the gun should be as safe as possible.

It's still a personal choice. You can carry anyway you like and I'll do the same.

[Barth]

except glocks!!! or kimber solo

I know it's strange.
And I'm not sure of the correct terminology.
Didn't realize it until recently actually.
But all striker fired guns are not the same.
The Kimber Solo is actually considered a SA striker gun
and has an external safety.
Where the Glock safe action triggers
are not considered SA but DA.

I think the Kimber may be fully cocked, so to speak,
and the Glock is semi-cocked. Where you pull the plunger
the rest of the way back with the trigger.

I think pocket carry of a Kimber Solo may well be ill advised.

[jocko]

no ur right the kiimber is at leat 90% cocked kwhere as the glock is close to 50% . Wasn't trying to argue aqnythig either just pointing out that striker fired guns are certainly not all the same. I thought at one time I might have the hots for a sol but when I foundout it was SA, I said no way is that fokker going in my pocket safety or not. Sice then reports are iffy on the gun to, so glad I errored on the side of caution. I consider the glock SAS a piss poor excuse for any safety but that is my opinion to. Just not sure if they made a glock the saize and wieght of the pm9 with the glock SAS thgat I would wantto pocket it either: Just sayin.